HOA-Lack of Funds

Started by SidneyP • 25 replies • 1935 views

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SidneyP (Florida)
Posts: 302

Posted:

Hopefully, some of you have been reading my post about the President and her hand picked Board members (except me) Post about how this President has placed us in such a financial bind because of hiring and firing repeatedly our lawn service(7)higher cost each time and MC's(3)latest one double the cost of the other two. This was done even though our delinquency was over $14,000. dollars. Now this was money we have not collected, therefore it is money alloted to the Budget but never received. Hope you can clearly see the picture of what has/is happening.

Today the Board (encluding me) receiver a e-mail from a HO stating that he had found damage to his vinyl that the landscaper had done. He then walked around and found more units with the same damage. He expressed that he feels the landscaper should be responsible for the repair.

This is the reply from the VP....who lives in Maine but does have a unit here that he visits a few times a year.

{quote}"Unless, someone can provide us with time-stamped digital pictures, or video of Mr. Pearson's crew actually causing damage, anything less is just unsubstantiated hearsay. Therefore the HOA is responsibile for the repair.

Mr. Adcock: we are aware of the damage, but we still lack the funds for repairs.

Problem is that the local distributor is in Alabama, and I haven't been able to get over there to buy a box of siding. A box of siding will only cost a couple hundred dollars, it's just getting there, and getting it back "intact"."

I think maybe now you can see my concern for the community....First off if the HOA can't even come up w/a couple of hundred dollars for repair for HO's who are paying dearly to cover them for things like this....And then to also be told "I haven't been able to get over there." I guess not, the man lives in Mass. He also said, ""Replacing the broken siding is on my list of things to do this winter"

Suppose it was a roof leak....

My wonderment is how this President could do this to the HO's and the community, after all she is a HO too....maybe it's like another poster said on another post, she plans to the the hXXX out of Dodge. Sell and leave the harm she has done behind.

SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202

Posted:

Sidney - if I read this right, you are dealing with 2 issues:

1) a budget that is running with a $14,000 deficit, with accounts receivable NOT coming in. It's back to the budget for mid-year adjustments, for the Board. Amend the budget and get back on track. (How is this president making and breaking contracts all by herself)??

2) You have a board member who is doing handyman jobs and replacing $200 worth of siding is "on his list" for winter jobs. If this is an "emergency" then hire this job out and ask for reimbursement from the landscape contractor OR withhold $200 from his next invoice. Of course, you have proof that this IS caused by the landscaper (weedwhipper or lawn mower is scraping the vinyl?)

GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022

Posted:

SidneyP - Are the homes in your HO single-family or townhouse/condo? Why were the landscapers fired 7 times, were the bids received for the service apples to apples in comparison to the bid of the previous landscaper? My wonderment is how can the other Board members treat their neighbors with such disrespect, the same that the Pres. seems to be doing.

SidneyP (Florida)
Posts: 302

Posted:

Susan---First Susan, I have posted so amny times in my different post to this site about our Board...

1)no one wants to be on the Board

2) because of this the same disfunctional President and her hand picked Board are re-elected by default.

3) this President picks her Board who follow her lead so you might as well say she is firing and hiring by herself.

4) we have no amenities, we have our grass cut, street lights paid, a small lake management, so Townhouse owners(77 but only 63 paying) pay $818. a year. We were doing fine until the Board continued to fire and hire. Never satisfied w/anyone. This last MC is what has killed us, doubling our management expense and I think this is the worst MC/PM of all. (In fact the DBPR says her license is pending.)If she can pass the test with all the mistakes she has made. I could pass the test w/o even taking the course.

5) there has never been a collection policy drawn up, there was NO late fee and interest was added some times and not others and to some HO's and not others. This is why we have such a deficit. This is of no fault of the HO's who have placed their trust in these people. All HO's are hurting financially not just the ones who won't pay. They are honoring their contract w/the Association but they can't afford to pay for their neighbor too and shouldn't be expected to.

6) did you read what the HO/VP said, unless it was on video, there was no proof the landscaper did it so therefore the Association was responsibile. Didn't you read that the VP said "we have NO funds"?

7) I believe I did state she had fired the landscaper so it would be kind of hard to with hold any money, plus we aren't sure he did it.

I have had several HO's tell me they will NOT pay a "Special Assessment" and that includes myself. Let this President and her hand picked Board pay extra to make up the difference.

If you couldn't pay the rent of say $650. a month, would go out and rent a house for $1,200. a month? I don't think so.....This is exactly what she has done. Both of our first two MC's charged the same $558. a month, placed $902.42 in our Reserves every month, we were doing fine, only a few delinquents. Jan. the next year there was a 10% increase in dues which brought us to the $818. And there hasn't been any funding to the Reserves since Apr.07. Actually the first MC quit us (though the President tells it, we fired them), the 2nd MC, myself and the President went after bids. I contacted one I had worked with before and I liked, I also got referrals (4 all good)this MC was even a little cheaper...the President talked down my pick at a meeting and talked the HO's into her choice, one she said,"I was highly impressed", funny she fired them to, she didn't like them either, "they won't give me anything or return my calls". I am not lying when I tell you every thing I have ever ask for (files,etc.) I was given. The 1st MC, I even went to their office and they gave me everything they has and put me in a room to pull and copy anything I wanted. I had no complaints at all. I was on the Board at first and even when I went for files simply as a HO, I was never turned down for anything.

You are right about one thing, we do need an ajustment, gey rid of this Board and this MC she hired w/no license.

GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022

Posted:

SidneyP - Your recent post indicates that dysfunctional thinking is on both sides of the association table. For example, all HO's will be obligated to pay a special assessment including yourself. The way to avoid one, or minimize the it's possible necessity of a large one, is to have willing volunteers to join a financial committee, put in the sweat equity, hire an accountant, review the financials and get qualified dedicated owners step up to take control of their association. Even if that means a petition to remove and replace the dead weight with responsible folks. Otherwise, all the drama, and situational irresponsibility can't be solved by just you.

SidneyP (Florida)
Posts: 302

Posted:

Gerald---I know I am obligated to pay a "Special Assessment" but let suppose I truly don't have the money like I KNOW for a fact some HO's don't. So we say we then get 10 or more delinquencies added to the pot. Then this "Special Assessment" isn't enough then do they keep placing "Special Assessment" until we're down to no one paying...If we're going to go Bankrupt because of this President then I'd rather go Bankrupt w/my money still in my pocket. I do not feel my thinking is dyfunctional, I think it is being realistic.

If HO's can't hold the Board accountible, can't hold the well paid PM/MC accountible and the HO's can't hold the Government accountible, where can we turn. Even if what you say is right, HO's pockets are only so deep. We must have gas to drive to work, to buy the food to keep our family alive, to pay the mortgage to keep a roof over our families head. Now which of these three things would you not pay to pay your assessments?

Gerald what dream land are you in...it sounds so easy to say, your{quote}"have willing volunteers to join a financial committee, put in the sweat equity, hire an accountant, review the financials and get qualified dedicated owners step up to take control of their association." Similar things like this are said daily on this site and so are simular problems, HO apathy, they just don't care until problems actually harm them....As I have said so many times, we have only 15/16 HO's out of 77, the rest are investor with many of them having units setting empty, they are hurting also financially.

Over and over I have also stated that this President and her Board have never sent a newsletter, have never informed them about anything. Still this is partly their fault because they never ask for any information. The only HO's that get a financial statement are the few that go to meeting, nothing never mailed out. So until Jan gets here and those dreaded invoices go out will these people wake up. I truly believe it is to late, we can never raise enough funds to get us back on our feet. We are moderate Townhouse people, the cheapest fairly new plaace around. These HO's bought there because this was all they could afford. OH! how many times have I read on this site that so many HO's don't even understand just what they are getting into when they buy into a HOA. We are given a stack of papers at closing, there is no time to read all those papers, and we are told to sign here, sign there.

Frankly, I have the money, my place was purchased for an investment but my unit has been empty for over a 2 year by my choice. After the hurricane, I saw on the news and my community what those people were doing to property. So for all this time I have been paying a mortgage, unilities (a must in Flordia)and my assessments. But my hear breaks for those HO's I talk to that are so worried (some old, some young) and so close to,losing their home.

About the petition, the five of us that are trying to rid ourselves of this MC/President (this just happened, it was only myself fighting this Board) Tonight I received a call from another HO's that was very upset and wanted to join our cause to case the neighborhood with support from the few HO's we have. I will be mailing out letters and files to all AOL HO's and do my best to convience them to ask questions for themselves, not just take my word....I did this, send letters, last Nov...I received two e-mails and one phone call. Our doc's say we only need 10% on a petition (7) HO's. We send it to the Board request her to resign and requesting a meeting if she does not resign. I believe she has 10 days to call the meeting.

As always, I am so sorry this is so long. I just can't seem to stop once I get started...I'm not proof reading for mistakes, it's after 9

M, I have been on this computer all day w/HOA business. This 72 year old lady is very tired....Good night, sweet dreams and Gerald tell me how to get to your dreamland to find all these volunteers.

GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022

Posted:

SindneyP - As for your extremely rude comment to me, "what dream land are you in..., how to get to your dreamland to find all these volunteers", the kind of problems you are posting are not unique to only you. I never said overcoming your difficulties would be easy. The advice I give comes from years of knowledge and first hand experience with volatile and dysfunctional boards. However, according to your figures, the threshold of percentage interest to petition shouldn't be that difficult to achieve. And your comment, "how to get to your dreamland to find all these volunteers", is therefore 100% uncalled for. I'm sure you can do the math but here goes anyway. Your docs state you need 10%, and you have 15/16 out of 77. That's anywhere between 19 and 20%. All you need is 10%, half or 8 owners. You already have 5 out of the 8.

If you and other owners don't have the money to fund the necessities of the association than each, or everyone together will have to make a determination to resolve that financial crisis. If the special assessment is really necessary and it can't be funded by everyone's fair share than liens will be placed upon the home, eventually at some point. I'm sure that's pretty obvious to you.

BradP (Kansas)
Posts: 2,640

Posted:

Sidney:

Until you get rid of the board it will only get worse...and once you do it will take either a significant raising of the dues or years of sacrifice to catch up.

And for them to just take it in the shorts on the siding is ridiculous, make an attempt at least to recover the damages from the contractor.

SidneyP (Florida)
Posts: 302

Posted:

Gerald...I am sorry that you took my comment as being rude, it certainly wasn't meany yhat way. All I was saying getting volunteers is easier said then done. Don't you think I have tried is these 2 1/2 years. I have spent hours and hours on my computer, compiling files and keeping up with and researching laws....

Gerald{quote}"the kind of problems you are posting are not unique to only you"....I believe I said this in my post. That's why I expect posters to understand just how hard it is to get volunteers.

Sidney{quote}"how to get to your dreamland to find all these volunteers"....I was only asking for your help, if you could suggest any way other than what I have already done to get HO's to volunteer. I have no idea why my statement was uncalled for. Help is all I wanted.

Gerald{quote}"I'm sure you can do the math but here goes anyway. Your docs state you need 10%, and you have 15/16 out of 77. That's anywhere between 19 and 20%. All you need is 10%, half or 8 owners. You already have 5 out of the 8."....I do believe this is exactly what I said, well I did say 7 HO's and we are starting a petition.

Gerald{quote}"If you and other owners don't have the money to fund the necessities of the association than each, or everyone together will have to make a determination to resolve that financial crisis. If the special assessment is really necessary and it can't be funded by everyone's fair share than liens will be placed upon the home, eventually at some point. I'm sure that's pretty obvious to you."

What is obvious to me is: if we have 14 delinquent (maybe even more,haven't received the July balance sheet and aging accounts)that don't pay their assessment dues, they certainly aren't going to pay a "Special Assessment". As I also stated is that the HO's in our community are either minus wage earners or retired old people like myself...there simply is no extra money....If the VP told a HO that we don't have the funds to fix a $200./$300. siding repair, just where is the over $400. X 14 coming from to file each lien w/an attorney?...Liens won't pay the bills.

I offered 1 1/2 years to do most of the work to self manage when I saw that we were sliding down hill and would soon be over our heads.
This President refused to even think about. And what did she do, hire a MC that cost the HO's double what we were paying. For so long, I was the only "watch dog" the community had. I put in the hours to find all the wrongs the Board/MC, took the time to compose, print and send out 77 letters at my expense and I only got 3 responses. Now at least a few HO's have come to the wheel and are helping. Reguardless, it will take some doing to get our finances back on track. Our first goal right now is to get rid of the MC who is draining the Association dry, in which we have send complaints to the DBPR for help. We will also be working on the petition to outst the President.

So Gerald, again, I am sorry if you took offence of what I said about a "dreamland". It is so easy to say, get HO's to volunteer but we all know it's not easy....I was only asking for help....Wish I had one of those "EASY BUTTONS" like the ad on TV....

GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022

Posted:

SidneyP - While I appreciate your apology, you posted twice I was in a dreamland. You may have meant something else but upon read it was rather offensive. If all you meant was that finding volunteers was hard than write it, rather write that I am in a dreamland. Of which I am not.

You wrote, "If the VP told a HO that we don't have the funds to fix a $200./$300. siding repair, just where is the over $400. X 14 coming from to file each lien w/an attorney?...Liens won't pay the bills."

Perhaps you are making a premature extrapolation? Additionally, it is hearsay if you didn't hear it firsthand from the VP.

You offered to self-manage, but that may or may not be a possibility, depends on your governing documents. In my association self-management must go to a 2/3rd's majority vote of the community. So there may be nothing duplicitous in the denial of your services. Even if your association can self-manage, you should be very cautious about undertaking the day job.

It's the Board and the lackluster owner participation that is draining the association, not just the MC. The MC is an employee of the association and the Board is permitting expenses that you believe are inordinate. Place the blame upon the Board, there will always be unscrupulous vendors.

SidneyP (Florida)
Posts: 302

Posted:

Brad...I have been fighting this Board for 2 1/2 years by myself, no support from any HO..they would come to me w/there complaints and want me to handle it but they wouldn't step up to the plate...I now have a handful for HO's working w/me and I beleive we can get rid of the President and I'm sure her little clan will follow. I have no idea how quickly the DBPR works or even if they will do anything about the PM not having a license (one is pending).

Our problem is (if you have been reading my post)funds. This President has placed us so far in the red, I don't know how we can get back on our feet. As I have stated, we're a fairly new neigherhood (2002) but we also the least expensive place to buy "new". Our community is made up of minum wage and retired older HO's....with the amount of money we will need, there is no way to funds can be raised to the point of getting us out of this mess.

We are going to try our best to get rid of the problem makers and only hope for the best. The Big wake up call will come Jan./09 when we start over again w/a new Budget and a "Special Assessment" imposed. All we can do is wait and see.

SidneyP (Florida)
Posts: 302

Posted:

Gerald...

"You wrote, "If the VP told a HO that we don't have the funds to fix a $200./$300. siding repair, just where is the over $400. X 14 coming from to file each lien w/an attorney?...Liens won't pay the bills."

Perhaps you are making a premature extrapolation? Additionally, it is hearsay if you didn't hear it firsthand from the VP."

Gerald, I am on the Board as treasurer. The statement above, I did get first hand, in a long e-mail from the VP to all Board member, the PM and the HO.....And being the treasurer I have record of all the financial information. I know what we have in our opersting account. I know that some bills were not paid for June until the July semi assessments started coming in.

About the MC/PM...when I searched the DBPR it is right there in black and white that the PM does not have a CAM license, that she has one pending. From the mistakes she has made, I know more than she does w/o even taking the CAM course. If the MC knew she did not have an active license yet, yes, I can blame the MC for giving this woman the position.

GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022

Posted:

SidneyP - What relevance does the fact that the PM's license is pending, and that you feel you are more qualified than her have to do with your association's ability or not to self-manage? The fact that you are the treasurer means you can make your qualified recommendations as an officer of the Board, and vote your conscience. As for paying the bills once the assessments come in, sometimes that is what occurs. Especially if the vendors don't mind. As the treasurer, is there a reserve account?

JohnK3 (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 967

Posted:

Sidney,

I applaud your dedication and efforts to get your HOA back into some semblence of normality.

As has been noted previously, it appears you have enough backing - strike that - perhaps enough backing to remove the current Board, and then, if you accomplish that, the PM.

IMO, focus on your efforts to replace the Board. Dreamland or not.

SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202

Posted:

Sidney - please post the EXACT wording in your bylaws that allows for removal of board members and/or officers- including the reasons.
duin.

Call me dense, but you keep saying "she" did this and hired that. Do you have a Board? Are these things going through motions (to hire and fire)? ARe you saying that she is making decisions ON HER OWN without board approval?

If she is spending unauthorized money OR signing contracts without the other board members knowing, she can be removed immediately.

"She" certainly did get a lot of power. How did that happen?

GeorgerwilliamsW (Indiana)
Posts: 975

Posted:

Sidney, if you have not seen this article, it may be of some help to you.

State rep wants input on homeowners associations

Rabaina said the big issue among the complaints was the lack of fiscal accountability of the association boards, as well as the abuse of power by board members.

[email protected]

http://www.sunnewspapers.net/articles/llnews.aspx?articleID=7709&bnpg=0

SidneyP (Florida)
Posts: 302

Posted:

Susan....Our recall policy is like everyone elses. Without HO support a recall could never be done...We are now writting up a petition to ask her to resign...this only requires 10%.

I have answered this question before...When I say "she", I really do mean the Board BUT because "WE" meaning the few HO's that try to do anything (and this is only of late) It was only me fighting for a long time....Because there are NO HO's that will step up to the plate to run for Board member at election time, this President remains as President, there is NO opposition. The other Board members we had way back when resigned because of the way things were being run (I even resigned myself-so very sorry I did but I tried right away to with drawn my resignation) In fact, this Presidnet wrote me and ask me please to reconsider and gave me a deadline to let her know. I did what she ask. I begin sending e-mail suggesting that it was time for us to start on our Budget. I believed I was still on the Board....a month later I received a regtistered letter telling me that mt resignation was effective when presented. I have tried over and over to volunteer and she would NOT let me.

So, this is why I always say "she"....she has hand picked every Board member and they do exactly as she says. The former treasurer was the only Board member who voted against her wishes some of the time. This treasurer strated e-mailing me everything that was going on and all the financials near the end of last year...I had already decided to go after proxy's to try to get back on the Board, which I did get....The treasurer resigned at the election meeting so that I could move into her spot. The President had no idea this was being done. We then had the VP move so the former treasurer right away volunteered for the position. The President would not give her a firm answer, said a replacement would come at the next meeting....To our surprise when the meeting came, the President has brought her own replacement. I was so surprised because I had ask and begged this woman several times to please run for the Board.

This again is why I say "she"...except for me, the other 3 board members follow her lead...She has already sent me two e-mails telling me she was going to have me removed. This was suppose to be done at the July 14th meeting, no mention of this was ever brought up...Like everything else she has not bothered to read, she could not do this since I was elected by the members. She could though have taken my position away and made me simply a director. This didn't happen either.

At this last meeting, she already had a contract ready to be signed for a new attorney and a new lawn service. I knew nothing about either until she brought this us, if the other Board members knew about this I don't know but I know I didn't. She and the "PM" had a consultation w/the attorney 3 weeks earlier and had the bids for the lawn service. I'm sure they had already made up their minds before the meeting which lawn service they would pick. This company was one the "PM" uses and was also the highest. I voted no on both issues.

This is how this soap opera is playing out.

SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202

Posted:

Why don't you do yourself (and your blood pressure) a favor and resign, and volunteer at the local shelter or library? There is wisdom in knowing when to step back and let other people be wrong. It takes time, but your health must be suffering!

This board group sounds like it is entrenched, and you are trying to wake up an apathetic group of homeowners who don't want to be bothered.

In general, 10% is the petition number required just to get a meeting for the purpose of the recall. That does not mean you have the actual meeting votes to remove this woman. Then there are her supporters.

4 against 1? I don't like the odds.

KirkW1 (Texas)
Posts: 1,665

Posted:

I have questions regarding the damage to the siding:

1) Hate to agree with your president, but you do need at least some evidence that the damage was caused by the landscape crew. Is there any evidence of such?

2) Why can this siding not be shipped to where you are? The stuff is shipped all the time.

3) What about the warranty on the siding? I will admit to having a limited knowledge of the stuff, but most I have seen caries a pretty heft warranty. That should be investigated.

SidneyP (Florida)
Posts: 302

Posted:

Susan....Sorry to say I am already have high blood pressure, high cholesterol, diabetes and arthritis that I have had for 55 years and am on meds for all. My hands are twisted and crippled but the pain is gone from them now but my knees are compertly worn out, I can walk or stand for only shorts periods of time. April of 07 I had a mastectomy. So I already have every thing why worry about it now.

I raised six children, worked until 11 years (incase you haven't read, I'm 72)ago and volunteered at juvenile court,even brought home two boys that there mothers didn't want, volunteered in the adult prison sysyem, volunteered a the adult prison work release, volunteered at the Naval hospital and went to college working for a criminal justice degree (which I never finished)

I have double stepped my whole life, I must be active in something or I would just sit around and be sorry for myself and that doesn't fit my persona....I would love to volunteer again but it would be unfair to obligate myself where I would be depended on. I never know just how I will feel when I wake up, therefore I I can't do that any more.

I do this for I suppose personal reasons. I have to keep busy, I have to fill a void of being usefull and of help to someone if I can. I am taking care of my 96 year old mother and believe it or not her health is better than mine. She sits in her room in a semi state of depression because of my father death last year. I do this so that Imay feel useful in some way. I do thisfor my own satisfaction. A up lift if I can accomlish some good and help to others.

This post probable doesn't beling on this site but I just felt that you shold know just why I do the things I do. If it doesn't fit the admin can delete.....

MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491

Posted:

If the admin does, I'm glad I read it before they could.

Best of luck to you, Sydney.

GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022

Posted:

SidneyP - You posted that you were on the Board as treasurer. Yet you indicate you resigned from the Board? Which one is it, are you on the Board and treasurer or not?

MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043

Posted:

Sydney,

I, too, am glad to have had the opportunity to read your bio. You are certainly to be admired! All I can say is, "keep up the good work" -- whatever it takes to get you through the day and make you feel good. BTW, I thought "Sydney" was a guy! LOL

SidneyP (Florida)
Posts: 302

Posted:

Gerald, I'm tired of defending myself to you....I don't lie and I haven't lied...if you had read my post you would know the answer to that question...I was on the original Board as secretary when we first took over from the developer....I resigned....I was elected back on the Board March 31st/08....

SidneyP (Florida)
Posts: 302

Posted:

Oh! well Mary....Sidney is the boys verison, but this is what my mother gave me....My grand daughter was named after me but the spelled her name correctly...Sydney....Well, I kinda look like a boy on one side...lol

By the way, I do love what I am doing....if I can help just a tiny bit I will be happy. After all my effort, it seems I have finally got the ball rolling, slowly but rolling w/HO's interest and support.

GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022

Posted:

SidneyP - Who said you lied? Not me. Those are your words, not mine. I have read your posts and found them to be unclear if you were on or off the board. You wrote, "I believed I was still on the Board....a month later I received a regtistered letter telling me that mt resignation was effective when presented. I have tried over and over to volunteer and she would NOT let me."

Your bit of detail that you were elected back on the Board March 31st/08 was nowhere in your other posts, nor one subsequent to the above quote.

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