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DanielS20 (South Carolina)
Posts: 7
Posted:
We have made a request to our HOA to allow us to remove a tree from our front yard. This tree has cost us several thousand dollars over the last few years in plumbing bills as the roots have gotten into our sewer and water lines. The board responded that we must plant a "suitable replacement" tree in order for our request to be granted. We have several neighbors on our cul-de-sac who have requested tree removal and their requests were granted with no condition of tree replacement. We live on a patio home so our front yards are very small and we fear that planting another tree will just cause us the same problems.

Can I remove this tree even though I do not plan on replacing it as the board requires?
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Can you quote exactly what your covenants say about tree removal or changing the landscaping of one's front yard?

Legally the covenants represent a contract between the homeowner and the HOA corporation. Boards typically have the authority to enforce the covenants. But if what the board is doing here is outside of the four corners of the covenants, then the board should not be asking you to plant a new tree.

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
If your covenants allow slow the Board to make rules or perhaps architectural guidelines about such matters as what may/may nt be in front years, then your want to read the rules or ARC guidelines.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
If they want you to plant another tree, why not go to a landscaping or gardening company that might have an arborist you can consult? We had the same problem in my community and the main problem was that the developer planted trees too close to the homes and that's how they caused problems with the foundations and sewer line disruption. After the community had to pay $5K or so every time this happened, we finally had an arborist walk around the community and identify which trees were on the verge of causing more problems and cut them down over the next three or four years. We also got recommendations on where replacements should be planted and what type of trees to avoid.

Here's an article on other ways you might prevent sewer line disruption - https://nexgenairandplumbing.com/how-to-avoid-tree-roots-in-your-sewer-line/ Note growth inhibitor chemicals like Rid-X are also an option - dump that in your sewer cleanout once or twice a year and that would be a lot cheaper than spending money on repairs.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,051
Posted:
There are trees with non-invasive roots. Crepe Myrtle comes to mind as one of them.
DanielS20 (South Carolina)
Posts: 7
Posted:
The document states THAT IN NO CASE SHALL A TREE WITH A DIAMETER OF 4 INCHES OR MORE BE REMOVED WITHOUT THE APPROVAL OF THE ARB(Architectural Review Board). None of our neighbors(5 or 6) that have had trees removed been required to replace them. We feel the ARB set a precedent over the years with no tree replacement required, but apparently now that has been changed,
DanielS20 (South Carolina)
Posts: 7
Posted:
The document states THAT IN NO CASE SHALL A TREE WITH A DIAMETER OF 4 INCHES OR MORE BE REMOVED WITHOUT THE APPROVAL OF THE ARB(Architectural Review Board). None of our neighbors(5 or 6) that have had trees removed been required to replace them. We feel the ARB set a precedent over the years with no tree replacement required, but apparently now that has been changed,
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
What is the document's name that states the "no removal" clause. Is there any document that states you must replace the removed tree? A board may not just order owners to do things or not do things without th restrictions or requirements n being in some kind of document that was approved by the Board at a board meeting.

And did you orders to replace the tree really come from "the board?" Or was it form a person? Or? Pleas name exactly who wrote that you must replace the tree and what thier title is (if any.). Thanks.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DanielS20 on 01/14/2024 6:10 PM
The document states THAT IN NO CASE SHALL A TREE WITH A DIAMETER OF 4 INCHES OR MORE BE REMOVED WITHOUT THE APPROVAL OF THE ARB(Architectural Review Board).
Is "the document" in the recorded covenants or not?

If what you quoted is in the covenants, violating this covenant is a big legal deal. If what you quoted is not in the covenants, then you might actually be free to remove the tree without facing any liability.

Furthermore, if this is all the covenants say on this subject, then the ARB does not have the legal authority to require you to replace the tree.

Lastly, given the damage the tree is doing, removing it is by far the very best option. Do not believe that bullsht-t about dumping certain poisons down the drain. You know the situation best. Take the tree out. Period.

The HOA is on very thin ice refusing you all approval when time is at least somewhat of the essence.

Answer the question above, and I can you better advice.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KerryL1 on 01/14/2024 6:21 PM
What is the document's name that states the "no removal" clause. Is there any document that states you must replace the removed tree? A board may not just order owners to do things or not do things without th restrictions or requirements n being in some kind of document that was approved by the Board at a board meeting.
... and the board's "order" has to be within the four corners of the CC&Rs.
DanielS20 (South Carolina)
Posts: 7
Posted:
The document from which I posted the quote regarding tree removal is from a document named Covenants of Shoal Creek. It does not state replacement of a tree anywhere in the document.
The email interaction I am having is from the HOA, no person has signed any of the emails.
JackS20 (North Carolina)
Posts: 263
Posted:
Just plant the dang tree, you can get minature ones, or just put a plastic liner around it, or
Just take a shovel and cut the roots once a year and it will never get big.

It will be a lot easier than taking the HOA to court which is your only option once they start fining you.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DanielS20 on 01/14/2024 6:40 PM
The document from which I posted the quote regarding tree removal is from a document named Covenants of Shoal Creek. It does not state replacement of a tree anywhere in the document.
Excellent.

The courts recognize covenants to be contractual terms. Hear me? You and all the owners have a contract between yourselves and the HOA corporation. The terms of the contract are what are given in the covenants. The board cannot enforce a contractual term that does not exist. In this case, there is no requirement to replace the tree.

"Covenants" here have the meaning in both the bible (binding one to another) and in contract law.

Don't let any chucklehead director say "We-ellll, in my infinite wisdom as a neighbor with forty years riding a desk as a VP of the Acme corporation, this is ju-ust common sense. Ya gotta put in another tree. We are the board. We say so. End of discussion."

Wrong. The contract (covenants) is (are) everything. Ignore all chuckleheads. Get the approval. On the paperwork, cross out the part about replacing the tree. Sign. Keep a copy for yourself. Take out the tree.

If and when the HOA fines you, post back.

I am expert at tree roots. That includes having acquaintances where the roots lifted the foundation of a home costing $100,000 f of damage in 2014 dollars. Plus acquaintances where the sewer lines backed up to the tune of an inch of sewage in the living room. Imagine.
KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239
Posted:
Many HOAs will have language that a "healthy" tree, when removed, should be replaced by another "healthy" tree whereas dead or leaning trees can be removed for safety reasons. That may be the issue here. That said, the HOA should be cognizant that roots are invading your drains, which is a common occurrence. It's not reasonable to plant over top of your drain pipe but could be reasonable to ask to replace a tree with a new tree.

Are you communicating with someone on your board or this an email-based communication chain between you and the board or management office? I can't imagine there being this as being overly controversial.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
I've been trying to learn with whom Daniel's communicating, who told him he must replace the tree-- and he. does not seem to know, Kelly. He wrote: "The email interaction I am having is from the HOA, no person has signed any of the emails." I guess my next question is, Daniel, to whom are the emails addressed that you send to "the HOA?" What I'm trying to get at is: what kind of authority the email sender does or does not have???

I also want to return to your covenants, which state: " IN NO CASE SHALL A TREE WITH A DIAMETER OF 4 INCHES OR MORE BE REMOVED WITHOUT THE APPROVAL OF THE ARB(Architectural Review Board)." This should mean that somewhere in your covenants, the HOA has the authority to (or even "must") create an ARB, right? Do the covenants go on to say that the ARB can make rules about the exterior appearance of fronts of homes, yards, etc.?

And if so, does the ARB have its own written guidelines, which MIGHT say something like: if approval is given to remove a tree, it must be replaced....???

If it were me, I'd follow Wendy's advice. Life's too short, etc. ...
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KerryL1 on 01/15/2024 11:31 AM
Do the covenants go on to say that the ARB can make rules about the exterior appearance of fronts of homes, yards, etc.?

And if so, does the ARB have its own written guidelines, which MIGHT say something like: if approval is given to remove a tree, it must be replaced....???
The ARB may very well have some authority to provide written guidelines. But the authority exercised still has to be within the four corners of the covenants. If the governing documents are vague on front yard appearance, then the ARB cannot make up rules that are de facto covenants that in turn, are outside the current covenants.

On the above assumptions (within this post), anyone who has read a lot of covenants and case law might then say: This means that the ARB has to approve every reasonable request to remove a tree, correct?

Yup.

Such is my opinion.
LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
There are trees that do not have invasive root systems. I would look at options first.
What trees are recommended by your governing documents?
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,051
Posted:
The other option is to appeal to the board specifying that you are not looking for special treatment. You just want to be treated the same as other members. A tree in that location causes problems and [name them] removed similar trees and had no requirement to replant.
DanielS20 (South Carolina)
Posts: 7
Posted:
That is exactly what I have done.
DanielS20 (South Carolina)
Posts: 7
Posted:
The email address is just the email address of the HOA. The ARB is discussed at length in the covenants as well as a wealth of specifications for exterior changes to homes.
DanielS20 (South Carolina)
Posts: 7
Posted:
I appreciate all the good advice I have received over a very short period of time. I have contacted an attorney and see where it goes from here. A worse case scenario is that we have to plant another tree that certainly will be smaller and non invasive, I'm not fond of that choice but if we need to do that to rid ourselves of the existing tree so be it.

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