Choosing a management company

Started by EllyP • 17 replies • 1446 views

💬 Join us to post & get advice from 50,000 HOA & Condo leaders.

⚡ Takes 30 seconds

Already a member? Log in

EllyP (California)
Posts: 9

Posted:

I posted a few weeks ago regarding our apparently defunct HOA. Our HOA really has nothing - no fictitious name statement, no tax ID, nothing registered with the state or county, no copies of any documentation available anywhere that I've been able to track down. I think we might need to hire a management company to sort it out for us. Does anyone have any suggestions about good ways to choose a management company and what we might expect to pay? I'm assuming that it would be a short term involvement, because the HOA is small (4 units) and I think we could manage it once its set up correctly.

We're in CAlifornia, btw.

Thanks for any help,
Elly

JeffR7 (California)
Posts: 251

Posted:

Where in CA are you?

Your better option might be to go to an attorney. Either route will be expensive because you only have 4 units to carry the cost, and it's time consuming activity.

BradP (Kansas)
Posts: 2,640

Posted:

Elly:

well, if you can't find any documents at the state or county level and every stone you turn over has nothing then what can a management company do for you? If nothing exists or was ever recorded you can't collect dues, can't enforce covenants, etc. I don't know the laws in CA about forming an HOA out of existing units but without any documentation you have tough sledding and the previous poster is correct, an attorney is what you need but how are you going to split the cost when there is no mechanism to force the other homeowners to absorb it?

EllyP (California)
Posts: 9

Posted:

My husband is going to the county office tomorrow to see if they have any records on microfiche. I was hoping a management company could help us get everything set up again. As for the costs, yes, I have no idea, and judging from experience no-one is going to want to pay for it. And I'm not sure where that leaves us - should we just try and disband the HOA? Although from what I've read here that might be difficult if we have no standing.

EllyP (California)
Posts: 9

Posted:

The HOA is in Truckee, North Lake Tahoe

BradP (Kansas)
Posts: 2,640

Posted:

Elly

i am a little confused, without any documentation how can you have an HOA? Is there something you have that leads you to believe it is there? Three things you should look for, articles of incorpation are typically filed with the state, more specifically the secretary of state. Have you tried an online business search in your state?...secondly, bylaws, in our state they are not recorded anywhere, others are at the county...finally CC&R's will be recorded at the county level. if you can latch onto any of those that might help you, otherwise, who was the developer or architect on your project try that route as well...

JeffR7 (California)
Posts: 251

Posted:

One other place to look is your property Grand Deed. If there is an HOA it will be mentioned there.

EllyP (California)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Thanks everybody. It did just occur to me that maybe we don't have an official HOA. It's hard to tell exactly what might have existed because the outgoing president (30 years) doesn't appear to know and treated it as a 'mom and pop' where she collected money and paid insurance etc. But maybe there was never anything more (and I don't know what that means)

Thanks, and food for thought and more googling,
Elly

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

Do you know what you want a HOA for? Is it just to have a HOA for HOA sake? A HOA isn't necessary for all situations. If you and your neighbors have some common property or costs to share, then make arrangements to do that. A HOA would only benefit your situation as more enforcement to make people pay their share. Otherwise, I'd make other arrangements as individuals and look into those options instead.

Former HOA President

EllyP (California)
Posts: 9

Posted:

I don't think we necessarily need an HOA. Is there a name for what you suggested that would help us figure out what we need (and I wonder if that's what was done, as there doesn't appear to be anything else on record, unless its lapsed)

SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699

Posted:

Quote:

Keep digging, your not looking in the right places.

- You say 4 units. Are these single family homes (detached) or condominiums? (attached, same building)

- Go to your town hall, pull the file from the code enforcement officer on all 4 properties. Ask the officer about your road/development/etc.

- Check the registry of deeds. Look at your deed, the previous deed, on and on to where your HOA was created by the developer. Do this for all 4 properties.

- Look up the developer or HOA name you find in the deeds. You should find the HOA declaration, CCR's etc.

Quote:

I think we might need to hire a management company to sort it out for us. Does anyone have any suggestions about good ways to choose a management company and what we might expect to pay? I'm assuming that it would be a short term involvement, because the HOA is small (4 units)

No one will manage a 4 unit property, at least not for a reasonable price. But you may find a lawyer or mgmt. company to help you for $100-$400 or so an hour.

Quote:

It's hard to tell exactly what might have existed because the outgoing president (30 years) doesn't appear to know and treated it as a 'mom and pop' where she collected money and paid insurance etc.

Ask for a copy of the insurance policy. What does it cover? Common areas? Etc. It may give you a clue.

SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699

Posted:

Quote:

should we just try and disband the HOA?

You cant disband the HOA if you know nothing about it. There may be common area that cannot be sold which would prevent you from disbanding. You need more info.

EllyP (California)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Thanks, that is helpful, I'll look into those leads.

Elly

SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699

Posted:

Elly,
You say 4 units. Are these single family homes (detached) or condominiums? (attached, same building)

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

I am confused of why you can't disband a HOA. Our documentation allows us to disband. It even tells us what has to happened what to do. That is we would have to have a Management Company run us. Which isn't a good option for our HOA due to it's set up and shared land etc...However, there are those HOA's that disbanding is an option and would fit their needs. Those without shared interest or common properties. Although there may be an issue with the property as far as property description. No more common property and it becoming the owner's responsibility of the land, could arise a few minor issues.

HOA's were formed as sales tools by the developer and builder. Once they leave the picture, the owners can do what they want. They can maintain the HOA themselves, hire a management company, or disband to take care of their own responsibilities. The records of this ever being a HOA is most likely attached to the builder/developer's company.

If you do share common areas such as structural (roofs, stairs, walls...etc), a management company or HOA may best serve you to have. If there are no real shared property, then it may be best to disband. Otherwise, the bottom 2 owners may have to pay part of the top 2 owner's roofing costs. Which without an HOA, may cause some major problems...

Former HOA President

BradP (Kansas)
Posts: 2,640

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MelissaP1 on 11/01/2011 9:19 AM
I am confused of why you can't disband a HOA. Our documentation allows us to disband. It even tells us what has to happened what to do. That is we would have to have a Management Company run us. Which isn't a good option for our HOA due to it's set up and shared land etc...However, there are those HOA's that disbanding is an option and would fit their needs. Those without shared interest or common properties. Although there may be an issue with the property as far as property description. No more common property and it becoming the owner's responsibility of the land, could arise a few minor issues.

HOA's were formed as sales tools by the developer and builder. Once they leave the picture, the owners can do what they want. They can maintain the HOA themselves, hire a management company, or disband to take care of their own responsibilities. The records of this ever being a HOA is most likely attached to the builder/developer's company.

If you do share common areas such as structural (roofs, stairs, walls...etc), a management company or HOA may best serve you to have. If there are no real shared property, then it may be best to disband. Otherwise, the bottom 2 owners may have to pay part of the top 2 owner's roofing costs. Which without an HOA, may cause some major problems...

How can you disband an HOA that doesn't exist? As of right now She can't find any documentation, CC&R's, bylaws, articles of incorporation to suggest an actual HOA ever existed.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

BradP, that was a response to another poster saying you can't disband a HOA. Which I believe isn't true. You can disband a HOA. This case there may have been a HOA that is basically defunct too long that it no longer exists. If any paperwork did exist, it would probably be under the original builders/developer who walked away years ago leaving it up to the owners.

The only way this may become an issue, is for certain repairs that would effect the whole. Otherwise, it's up to the individual owners to handle their own.

Former HOA President

EllyP (California)
Posts: 9

Posted:

I'm seeing an attorney on Tuesday

🎯 You've read this entire discussion

Join the conversation with 50,000 HOA & Condo Leaders:

✓ Ask follow-up questions
✓ Share your experience
✓ Get expert advice
✓ Access 350,000 discussions

Create Free Account →

⚡ Takes 30 seconds

Already a member? Log in here