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Subject: Officially burned out
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Author Messages
JackJ9


Posts:0


07/21/2021 2:42 PM  
After spending a lot of my personal time working with vendor certificates of insurance to get a job done, I'm officially burned out. We've had a lot of vendor non-performance issues as of late. Our irrigation system has failed due to non-performing vendors, grass is growing brown, plants are dying, homeowners are complaining.

I joined the board to help improve things in the community, but spend the past four months doing more running the association type work rather than being able to contribute to cleaning up and making our community nicer and more liveable. It seems that my plate is full just ensuring that vendors perform and meet expectations.

I have thought for a long time, and seriously believe, that we need a property manager who can effectively run our association rather than trying to have community volunteers run it. One that will ensure that vendors are performing, and when not, be effective at getting them to perform. Not just a middle person who simply forwards e-mails back and forth between the board and vendors.

I'm tired. I've been going full throttle at making our community nicer. I'm not going to quit the board, but I can't keep going at the pace that I have been going at. Our community looks nicer since I joined the board, and things are moving forward, but I need professional help from a real property manager to support me. I can ask small things of other board members but don't want to burn them out to.

Any advice is appreciated.
ChristinaW2
(California)

Posts:4


07/21/2021 2:51 PM  
Is there a way to rotate these responsibilities? Or at least divide them amongst board members. We self managed until 5 years ago. There is still much work to be done by board and an added cost of management. Do you have a community bulletin board to air your concerns and list priorities?
SheliaH
(Indiana)

Posts:4284


07/21/2021 4:00 PM  
I can't remember if I suggested to you what I'm about to suggest - if so, here we go again and this time, pay attention!

It's great you've put in a lot of time and effort as aboard mem. Too many show up once a month and decide how to spend money and go along with the crowd because that's easier. I've found one or two people end up dominating the board for that reason, and you either end up flaming out like you're about to do, or they start believing their ish don't stink and you have the beginning of a board member running wild. Neither scenario ends well for you and your neighbors.

Time for you to man up and tell your board members you're not made of stone and as much as you've enjoyed the work, it's time for them to pitch in or hire a property manager to handle the daily details. Self managed communities work best when everyone pitches in and if they can't or don't want to, the board will have to hire a property manager to do it for them.

In the meantime, your tendency to run and run like a hamster on a wheel ends right now. Tell them what you'll do and stop. They may step up and then you might be tempted to jump in, but Don't Do It! If something doesn't get done, whoever volunteered to oversee that has to deal with the consequences. Homeowners may squawk at hiding a property manager, but they need to understand board members have a life outside the association. If they insist on something being addressed, they can volunteer.

You might also consider that you micromanage entirely too much. You have to get out of the way and trust people to do what you want. That doesn't mean they must do it exactly as you would, but as long as the work is done correctly, give people the space they need.

You sound like you're a great board member, and I'd hate to see you flame out like I did. I served for 10 years and near the the end I was tired and more than a little annoyed at my colleagues. That's when I realized that they may have sat around because they knew I'd jump in. I had to step down so they could see what they could do. I also came to understand that I did all i could do and maybe the next steps would have to be taken by people with fresh energy and ideas.

I don't know if that's you, but I think you need to step away and clear your head. Good luck in what you decide to do.
TimB4
(Tennessee)

Posts:17841


07/21/2021 4:02 PM  
Form a common area committee.
You can chair and have help from the committee.
JohnC46
(South Carolina)

Posts:11659


07/21/2021 4:44 PM  
Jack

After reading several of your posts, you are taking on to much. Either it is you personality and/or you do not trust others.
Time for you to delegate responsibilities.
KerryL1
(California)

Posts:8720


07/21/2021 4:57 PM  
Perhaps you missed it, Jack, but I've suggested your HOA hair a PM at more than, what?, 4 hours a week? 6 parks and 250 or more homes is too much for a board--especially one that only meets quarterly.

You're said you have no place for an office for such a PM, so you need to get one who'll drive over to your HOA at least weekly and inspect the parks and other common areas. Along with the tiny handful of tasks your PM does now you'll add the parks & dealing with their vendors. It sounds like you'll need a new PM.

Will your Board vote to seek a new management company to provide the services your HOA so clearly needs?

Or, as Tim suggests, call for members of your HOA to form a committee that focuses on the parks. Give them the authority to write a report for the Board to review and to write action items for the PM to handle. The Board will need to make their charter every clear and very tight so you don't have rogue members.

You clearly do a lot of work--probably way too much so you're a fine asset to your community. But perhaps there is a tendency to micromanage and to focus on every little detail (missing [empty] poop bags; gratitude bouquet of flowers for some owners). If you're hyper-observant--you "see everything" -- it's hard to focus on the big matters and ignore the smaller ones.
KerryL1
(California)

Posts:8720


07/21/2021 4:58 PM  
Perhaps you missed it, Jack, but I've suggested your HOA hair a PM at more than, what?, 4 hours a week? 6 parks and 250 or more homes is too much for a board--especially one that only meets quarterly.

You're said you have no place for an office for such a PM, so you need to get one who'll drive over to your HOA at least weekly and inspect the parks and other common areas. Along with the tiny handful of tasks your PM does now you'll add the parks & dealing with their vendors. It sounds like you'll need a new PM.

Will your Board vote to seek a new management company to provide the services your HOA so clearly needs?

Or, as Tim suggests, call for members of your HOA to form a committee that focuses on the parks. Give them the authority to write a report for the Board to review and to write action items for the PM to handle. The Board will need to make their charter every clear and very tight so you don't have rogue members.

You clearly do a lot of work--probably way too much so you're a fine asset to your community. But perhaps there is a tendency to micromanage and to focus on every little detail (missing [empty] poop bags; gratitude bouquet of flowers for some owners). If you're hyper-observant--you "see everything" -- it's hard to focus on the big matters and ignore the smaller ones.
AugustinD


Posts:1905


07/21/2021 5:35 PM  
Send an email to the other directors and state, "unless a property manager is hired by September 1, I will resign from the board." The assessment will have to go up to pay for the property manager. Too bad. You have given enough of your valuable time to this. Consider having a meeting of the board properly noticed to the membership where this is first on the agenda.

Meetings of Oregon HOA Boards are required to be open to members as indicated below. I am pretty sure this was pointed out in the past to JackJ9.

ORS 94.640(8)(a)
"All meetings of the board of directors of the association shall be open to owners, except that at the discretion of the board, the board may close the meeting to owners other than board members and meet in executive session to:

(A) Consult with legal counsel.

(B) Consider the following:

(i) Personnel matters, including salary negotiations and employee discipline;

(ii) Negotiation of contracts with third parties; or

(iii) Collection of unpaid assessments.

(b) Except in the case of an emergency, the board of directors of an association shall vote in an open meeting whether to meet in executive session. If the board of directors votes to meet in executive session, the presiding officer of the board of directors shall state the general nature of the action to be considered and, as precisely as possible, when and under what circumstances the deliberations can be disclosed to owners. The statement, motion or decision to meet in executive session must be included in the minutes of the meeting."
MaxB4
(California)

Posts:1594


07/21/2021 8:21 PM  
Posted By AugustinD on 07/21/2021 5:35 PM
Send an email to the other directors and state, "unless a property manager is hired by September 1, I will resign from the board." The assessment will have to go up to pay for the property manager. Too bad. You have given enough of your valuable time to this. Consider having a meeting of the board properly noticed to the membership where this is first on the agenda.

Meetings of Oregon HOA Boards are required to be open to members as indicated below. I am pretty sure this was pointed out in the past to JackJ9.

ORS 94.640(8)(a)
"All meetings of the board of directors of the association shall be open to owners, except that at the discretion of the board, the board may close the meeting to owners other than board members and meet in executive session to:

(A) Consult with legal counsel.

(B) Consider the following:

(i) Personnel matters, including salary negotiations and employee discipline;

(ii) Negotiation of contracts with third parties; or

(iii) Collection of unpaid assessments.

(b) Except in the case of an emergency, the board of directors of an association shall vote in an open meeting whether to meet in executive session. If the board of directors votes to meet in executive session, the presiding officer of the board of directors shall state the general nature of the action to be considered and, as precisely as possible, when and under what circumstances the deliberations can be disclosed to owners. The statement, motion or decision to meet in executive session must be included in the minutes of the meeting."



They have a property manager who Jack can't seem to be able to delegate anything to.
MelissaP1
(Alabama)

Posts:10584


07/22/2021 4:17 AM  
If you take this as a "job" and start hating it, then your done. If you own it, then it is shown it. Overall think most posters here and most likely your own membership is telling you to back off. Stop taking on too much. Not everything is your job. Again if you cant walk away and let someone else do something, then that is all on you. It is not on them.

I'd recommend taking a week or two off. Just walk away from doing HOA activities that aren't required. Like still keep signing the checks to pay the bills. However, don't make a decision or make a vote. Let the others do it.

Former HOA President
KerryL1
(California)

Posts:8720


07/24/2021 11:46 AM  
I've been thinking, Jack, that since you must hold open board meetings in OR, but you only hold 4 a year with 250+ homes and six parks, that your board needs to hold open meetings monthly. Your PM should attend and take meeting minutes. Say, where DO you hold board meetings???

It seems to me that your owners do not know you or the Board.

Open meetings may be fairly well attended. Some owners may want to play a role. Forming a Parks Committee or even assigning 1-2 owners to each particular park might ease some of the Board's burdens. Such individuals would would need a tight "charter," let's call it, so they don't run amok. But they could be given the authority to send their documented concerns to the PM weekly or monthly and copy the board.

I think Max forgets that your PM only works on your account about 4 hours a week.
MaxB4
(California)

Posts:1594


07/24/2021 12:19 PM  
Posted By KerryL1 on 07/24/2021 11:46 AM
I've been thinking, Jack, that since you must hold open board meetings in OR, but you only hold 4 a year with 250+ homes and six parks, that your board needs to hold open meetings monthly. Your PM should attend and take meeting minutes. Say, where DO you hold board meetings???

It seems to me that your owners do not know you or the Board.

Open meetings may be fairly well attended. Some owners may want to play a role. Forming a Parks Committee or even assigning 1-2 owners to each particular park might ease some of the Board's burdens. Such individuals would would need a tight "charter," let's call it, so they don't run amok. But they could be given the authority to send their documented concerns to the PM weekly or monthly and copy the board.

I think Max forgets that your PM only works on your account about 4 hours a week.



Do you have any idea how business really works? The dues in his HOA are about $84.00 per month, yours are what $1000.00-$1200.00 per month. The PM supposedly works 4 hours per week, but what about the other areas of the management company, such as bank deposits, accounting, receivables and payable, billing and so on. How does one association know how many hours are spent on their account. In your case, your manager and assistant are there onsite with office hours say 8-5. That is pretty easy to track. Then the management company that hired your managers does back office work, for which your association pays them well over $100K annually. Jack's HOA is paying far, far less than yours.

Now you're suggesting Jack meet monthly, the PM should attend and take minutes. Wait, isn't that what the Secretary, unless of course when they "craft a mess". That would require a change in the PM contract for extra time per week, more meetings and taking minutes.

Let me sum this up from the cheap seats. Jack has stated more than once that the only reason he is on the board and president is to take care of the parks. Sorry, IMHO, wrong answer, person with an agenda. He needs to learn to be a leader delegate, handle the whole community. Stop micromanaging, nobody going to want to work with you, not even the PM.

See Kerry, I don't forget.
KerryL1
(California)

Posts:8720


07/24/2021 2:29 PM  
I hope Jack considers my advice or parts of it. It's obvious that his HOA'll pay more if they hire a PM to do additional tasks. I don't see how details about my HOA can help Jack one bit.
BarbaraT1
(Texas)

Posts:588


07/26/2021 12:58 PM  
You're that person that insists on doing everything and then complains that no one helps you, but also refuses any help because nobody else can do it the exact way you want it done.

You will always be burned out.
KerryL1
(California)

Posts:8720


07/26/2021 4:10 PM  
Sigh. I think you're right, Barbara. Jack's received some positive ideas here and there and just seems to ignore them. I'm now thinking that I have no idea what he's seeking when he asks questions about teensy topics within the context of his large (acre-wise) HOA.

And he seems to ignore some questions. I know it sounds crazy, but I'm wondering if he's trolling us.

Say, Jack do all of these parks have any amenities in them? Does your HOA have any amenities other than the 6 parks? Where does the Board meet? Why not consider a Parks Committee?
JackJ9


Posts:0


07/27/2021 6:27 AM  
Posted By KerryL1 on 07/26/2021 4:10 PM
Sigh. I think you're right, Barbara. Jack's received some positive ideas here and there and just seems to ignore them. I'm now thinking that I have no idea what he's seeking when he asks questions about teensy topics within the context of his large (acre-wise) HOA.

And he seems to ignore some questions. I know it sounds crazy, but I'm wondering if he's trolling us.

Say, Jack do all of these parks have any amenities in them? Does your HOA have any amenities other than the 6 parks? Where does the Board meet? Why not consider a Parks Committee?




I'm not trolling you, but agree that the questions that I post here are different than most. People here seem to get more interested in legal questions, like interpretation of CC&Rs, voting rules, qoruom definitions, and the like. My questions are more of a practical nature like whether we should have a little free library or what to do with a vendor who failed to perform a service resulting into damage of our HOA property. But absolutely, I am not a troll here.

With regards to the rest of your questions, the ideas are under consideration. As you know, things happen slowly with boards of directors and HOAs, so maybe in a year we can implement them. They won't happen right away. In the meantime, our parks still need attention.
ND
(PA)

Posts:637


07/27/2021 8:59 AM  
Posted By JackJ9 on 07/27/2021 6:27 AM
Posted By KerryL1 on 07/26/2021 4:10 PM
Sigh. I think you're right, Barbara. Jack's received some positive ideas here and there and just seems to ignore them. I'm now thinking that I have no idea what he's seeking when he asks questions about teensy topics within the context of his large (acre-wise) HOA.

And he seems to ignore some questions. I know it sounds crazy, but I'm wondering if he's trolling us.

Say, Jack do all of these parks have any amenities in them? Does your HOA have any amenities other than the 6 parks? Where does the Board meet? Why not consider a Parks Committee?




I'm not trolling you, but agree that the questions that I post here are different than most. People here seem to get more interested in legal questions, like interpretation of CC&Rs, voting rules, qoruom definitions, and the like. My questions are more of a practical nature like whether we should have a little free library or what to do with a vendor who failed to perform a service resulting into damage of our HOA property. But absolutely, I am not a troll here.

With regards to the rest of your questions, the ideas are under consideration. As you know, things happen slowly with boards of directors and HOAs, so maybe in a year we can implement them. They won't happen right away. In the meantime, our parks still need attention.



I think your response here is a prime example of what many have tried to point out to you . . . your say your parks need attention, yet you spend time and effort exploring the intricacies of whether or not you should have a little free library and how to do it.

Since you are the main (only?) BOD Member doing things and your PM does not meet expectations (unsure if expectations are realistic given contract terms), you need to prioritize your tasks and focus your efforts on ONLY the top priority. Delegate other tasks that still must get done (other BOD, Officers, Committees, members, and/or hired contractors). And ignore everything else (e.g., little free libraries . . . as I'm sure your CCRs don't indicate the HOA is responsible for that).

Additionally, if you only meet 4x/year and you cannot unanimously come to agreement on things via email between meetings (if even allowed per state HOA law and CCRs), then YES, things will take you a painfully-long amount of time to accomplish. However, if you meet more frequently, perhaps things could get accomplished more quickly . . . but you still need to prioritize and delegate or ensure you have some help.
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