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Subject: Changing PM's
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Author Messages
LetA
(Nevada)

Posts:1466


06/13/2021 12:13 PM  


So It has been bought up between myself and another board member to change PM companies. They've had enough. Iv'e had enough, most of the community has had enough. Emails and communications ignored. Landscaping issues other service provider issues. It all can't be blamed on labor shortages. WE keep going round and round with the same issues and keep getting the same results.

So, I read the thread from 2008 on changing PM's Getting an RFP etc. Is is unethical or out of the ordinary to go knotting on doors of property management companies and meet face to face to get an idea of what we need?
KellyM3
(North Carolina)

Posts:1806


06/13/2021 12:21 PM  
No, it's completely ethical and smart to call early in the process before your contract expires. You need to know you're changing property managers no later than 60 days out so you can smoothly transition, in my opinion.
JohnC46
(South Carolina)

Posts:11665


06/13/2021 12:41 PM  
Posted By KellyM3 on 06/13/2021 12:21 PM
No, it's completely ethical and smart to call early in the process before your contract expires. You need to know you're changing property managers no later than 60 days out so you can smoothly transition, in my opinion.



I agree.
CathyA3
(Ohio)

Posts:2599


06/13/2021 1:20 PM  
Yes, totally fine. The PM's contract can be terminated with or without cause, as long as you give proper notice.

Personally, I think it's a good idea to keep your eyes open even if you're completely satisfied with your current PM. Good companies can experience problems that may cause you to rethink your current situation, and it's a good idea to remind people to never get complacent. :-)
JackJ9


Posts:0


06/13/2021 2:18 PM  
Posted By LetA on 06/13/2021 12:13 PM


So It has been bought up between myself and another board member to change PM companies. They've had enough. Iv'e had enough, most of the community has had enough. Emails and communications ignored. Landscaping issues other service provider issues. It all can't be blamed on labor shortages. WE keep going round and round with the same issues and keep getting the same results.

So, I read the thread from 2008 on changing PM's Getting an RFP etc. Is is unethical or out of the ordinary to go knotting on doors of property management companies and meet face to face to get an idea of what we need?




For what it's worth, our board limits the PM responsibility to three things:

1) Homeowner communication - newsletters, compliance issues, required mailings, deliquent dues not yet sent to the attorney's office
2) Accounting - provides all accounting services, including receiving checks, issuing payments, and preparing tax returns. Supporting annual audit falls into this category
3) Site visits - makes regular site visits several times per year to see if any homes are non-compliant with HOA rules

Everything else we handle ourselves. For example, you mention landscaping issues. We handle everything with the landscaping vendor except for paying the monthly invoices. We tried having the PM do that, but it didn't work out well. Same with all service providers. We handle them rather than trying to have the PM handle them. It's more work for the board but our community looks nicer because of it.
AugustinD


Posts:1920


06/13/2021 2:36 PM  
Posted By LetA on 06/13/2021 12:13 PM
So, I read the thread from 2008 on changing PM's Getting an RFP etc. Is is unethical or out of the ordinary to go knotting on doors of property management companies and meet face to face to get an idea of what we need?
I think this is a personal choice. If it were I, I would email (or knock on the door) any PM company that I honestly expected the board to ask for a bid.

Granted any PM company would convince you to let them bid.

I loathe HOA/COA directors who do not respect contractors' time. Some directors can be arrogant b-stards, as far as I am concerned.

How about starting a thread giving some of the key details of your HOA/COA (how many homes; condos or single family homes; common areas; on-site PM presence needed or not needed) and then asking for ideas on what your COA/HOA's RFP maybe should include? I figure the topic should be updated every so often. Technology is frequently changing how business is conducted.





PatJ1
(North Carolina)

Posts:295


06/13/2021 3:07 PM  
Review your current PM's contract carefully regarding termination terms. If you terminate outside of the contract terms there could be a hefty bill and they will not being the one's to point that out to you.

I've been on the Board for 8 years. We've had 4 PM companies and countless managers. One was so bad we gladly paid the early termination fee to move on. Always thought there was something better out there. In retrospect, we should have never left the company we had 3 PM's ago.

If we could take all the good points from each of them and spin them into one PM company we'd have it made.

You best preservation is to have a very active, educated, Board. Our Board has taken over almost all maintenance items and violations. I've learned more about plumbing, pools, HOA laws, landscaping, pest control, building permits, private road maintenance, sewer lines, and people than I care to know. I sold my house and moved into a condo because I didn't want the maintenance. That turned into 144 condo units in 20 buildings, and a pool, to maintain. Duh!


Board members are volunteers. Many have no idea what they're doing. Educate them. Don't beat them up.
LetA
(Nevada)

Posts:1466


06/13/2021 4:53 PM  
What are the contract terms for PM companies? Tell you the truth, I have never seen on the agenda to ratify the PM's contract renewal or otherwise.
KerryL1
(California)

Posts:8729


06/13/2021 5:20 PM  

LetA talks a lot about what (i'm guessing "she" does and how she seems to be alone in discovering issues and trying, alone, to fix them. This pattern goes back years. Tell us, LetA, how many directors are there? Are you the president?

This is an executive session matter for your BOARD. The two of you directors who want a change should call an executive session to get a vote of approval to permit you (two?) to visit or otherwise contact Management Companies (MCs) about their offerings, etc. Having read so many of your posts, where you're leaping off on your own to the rescue, you can give off an impression to other PMs that you want them to come to you. This can get back to their boards and hurt your HOA's rep.

At this executive session, you directors should agree on some basic services that you as a BOARD want. Do not simply gripe about what you do NOT want.

I'd like to see a little list of what you personally DO want (no more griping or complaints that also have been appearing here for years)

Agree with Augustin. Here or on a new thread, give us details of your premises. Detached homes we know. How many? Pool, we know. Attached to rest rooms? Attached to Clubhouse? Is there an office for an on-site PM if that's what you need? Entry to premises? Do you happened to know the % rentals?

You're very lucky to have so many talented PMs on this forum, LetA. Listen to them.

Finally don't leave us hanging as you so often do. You (your Board?) asked your attorney if you can ban a rule-breaking owner from using the pool for a year or indefinitely. You said you'd let us know the attorney's response. I don't recall seeing it. What is the response??
KellyM3
(North Carolina)

Posts:1806


06/13/2021 5:59 PM  
1. Pull your contract and see when it ends.
2. Look very closely to see if your HOA must give a "notice" of a number of days before the contract actually expires.
3. Once you know that date, begin calling other HOA-focused property managers in your area.
4. Be upfront that you're looking to change...no other reasons need to be given...and they'll be knocking on your door.
5. If you like the price you're currently paying, still get multiple bids from other companies. At day's end, match the price if nothing else.

6. Your current PM doesn't need to know anything about your inquiries.
7. Make sure you "quit" in writing.
8. Allow the new company to work with the "old" company on transitioning the accounts.

Above all, be sure you really want to "fire" your existing management company for reasons related to non-emotional business performance as it's very disruptive to your, otherwise, quiet dues payers. If you sense (and be honest w/ yourself) that you and your board colleague simply don't "like" your PM, that's zero grounds for disrupting this relationship.

If your problem is landscaping, the issue is with the landscaper or poor board performance. Be honest in your assessment and you'll be fine.
MarkM19
(Texas)

Posts:844


06/14/2021 6:07 AM  
Let A,
So while I have fired a couple of Property Management companies over the years. I think it is important to consider that the Management Company is not always the problem. Every company is only as good as their worst employee. Before you fire the company make sure that your problem is with the company verses the PM that handles your account.

If your HOA is like mine and I am sure it is a few Loud voices make your board think Everyone hates the PMC. When in most cases only a vocal minority hate them. When I do my research on the people who say nasty stuff on FB or next door it is usually because they have recently received a letter for a violation. It is important to realize that changing PMCs effects 100% of your community. Everyone gets a new company to contact and everyone has to change who they pay their dues to monthly or quarterly. Also remember the grass is not always greener on the other side. What happens if you make this change and the next person who is assigned your HOA is worse. Guess who gets blamed?
MarshallT
(New York)

Posts:180


06/14/2021 6:34 AM  
Hi,

This is not unethical at all. The PM company works for you, not the other way around. If you're not getting the services that were promised to you, it's time to start looking elsewhere.

Meetings are a great idea because you can ask questions and ensure you're both on the same page before you hire a new company.
LetA
(Nevada)

Posts:1466


06/14/2021 7:50 AM  
Posted By KerryL1 on 06/13/2021 5:20 PM

LetA talks a lot about what (i'm guessing "she" does and how she seems to be alone in discovering issues and trying, alone, to fix them. This pattern goes back years. Tell us, LetA, how many directors are there? Are you the president?

This is an executive session matter for your BOARD. The two of you directors who want a change should call an executive session to get a vote of approval to permit you (two?) to visit or otherwise contact Management Companies (MCs) about their offerings, etc. Having read so many of your posts, where you're leaping off on your own to the rescue, you can give off an impression to other PMs that you want them to come to you. This can get back to their boards and hurt your HOA's rep.

At this executive session, you directors should agree on some basic services that you as a BOARD want. Do not simply gripe about what you do NOT want.

I'd like to see a little list of what you personally DO want (no more griping or complaints that also have been appearing here for years)

Agree with Augustin. Here or on a new thread, give us details of your premises. Detached homes we know. How many? Pool, we know. Attached to rest rooms? Attached to Clubhouse? Is there an office for an on-site PM if that's what you need? Entry to premises? Do you happened to know the % rentals?

You're very lucky to have so many talented PMs on this forum, LetA. Listen to them.

Finally don't leave us hanging as you so often do. You (your Board?) asked your attorney if you can ban a rule-breaking owner from using the pool for a year or indefinitely. You said you'd let us know the attorney's response. I don't recall seeing it. What is the response??




Well I'm a guy lol

Do we call an executive session outside of the regular meeting? I need to pull up the by-laws. We are a single family no age restricted community of slightly more than 300 single family homes with attached garages. One pool and a small park, there's a horseshoe pitching area. Remember when I said the PM manager controls the whole smash and I feel the board is just a rubber stamp!! Well asking to get an option on banning the rule breaker got shot down by the PM.



KelleyM3 where do I find a copy of the PM's contract? I don't believe we have ever been given a copy of it.
KerryL1
(California)

Posts:8729


06/14/2021 9:10 AM  
Your board must have approved the contract. You must read it to learn what the PM is supposed to do. Get a copy form the MC. Does the PM have an office on the premises?

In CA, our HOA can and does call executive sessions that are not connected to open meetings. Right, read your Bylaws and if silent, NV statutes.

Without going back to the old post, I think you wrote that banning the guying form the pool area was with your HOA attorney. So...how could the PM shoot down that possibility??
KellyM3
(North Carolina)

Posts:1806


06/14/2021 9:13 AM  
Call the management office and request, at least, a digital copy of the contract for review.

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