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PeterB1 (Florida)
Posts: 257
Posted:
We have a small gated HOA with 24x7 security. We have the gates manned (and womaned) with licensed guards who are our employees.

Someone has proposed replacing the guards with 'virtual guards' - actually a remotely operated camera system. Has anyone used this type of system? Investigated this type of system? Or knows where there has been an evaluation of this type of system?

The company referenced was 'Envera Systems'.

Thanks
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,047
Posted:
You still have to pay someone to watch the monitors.

Wait, you are paying someone - your paying the company who hires who knows who to sit and watch the monitors for you. Perhaps the central monitoring is in the same town, same State, somewhere in the US or perhaps overseas.

By hiring your own employees (which can have it's own issues) you have full control and can easily replace them. Might not be that way for the system.

Oh, are you buying or renting the surveillance equipment? What about the phone line or internet connection? What happens if the camera is vandalized? What about power outages or internet interruptions (Battery backup only lasts so long). With physical guards, this isn't as big of an issue as it would be with central monitoring.

Lets see what your getting with the system. This would be:
A camera
A microphone
A speaker
A remote control of the gate (if needed)
An internet connection (so it can be connected to the central monitoring device)
Perhaps a phone line
Perhaps a UPS (battery backup)
Likely a Digital Video Recorder in central monitoring
Some unknown person/s in the central monitoring location to control all of this

Compare that with what you have and then ask which is better for the community.

PeterB1 (Florida)
Posts: 257
Posted:
Tim,

You are right on all points. BUT, it always comes down to $$$.

The cost of 'virtual security' is about one-half of what we pay today. People see the savings.

That is why I am looking for real-world experiences.

Thanks.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,047
Posted:
Peter,

It should never come down to dollars.

Decisions should be based on what is the best value for the money being spent and in the best interest of the Association. If Boards made decisions based only on how much it cost, then you might end up hiring people who cut corners.

If cost is an issue, I can offer the following options:

Explain the benefits to the membership when you ask for an increase in assessments (heck we were able to have the membership pass a 20% increase in assessments when we explained the benefits of the reserve study and properly funding the reserves).

Instead of hiring guards as employees, solicit bids from security companies.

Instead of hiring guards as employees, hire independent contractors so you don't have to provide benefits or pay employer share of taxes.

PaulT6 (California)
Posts: 409
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TimB4 on 10/13/2012 6:44 AM
Peter,

It should never come down to dollars.

Decisions should be based on what is the best value for the money being spent and in the best interest of the Association. If Boards made decisions based only on how much it cost, then you might end up hiring people who cut corners.

If cost is an issue, I can offer the following options:

Explain the benefits to the membership when you ask for an increase in assessments (heck we were able to have the membership pass a 20% increase in assessments when we explained the benefits of the reserve study and properly funding the reserves).

Instead of hiring guards as employees, solicit bids from security companies.

Instead of hiring guards as employees, hire independent contractors so you don't have to provide benefits or pay employer share of taxes.


Totally agree, just pay the dues and be secure. If members can't afford it they can move, living in an HOA is voluntary.

Paul T
DavidW5 (North Carolina)
Posts: 565
Posted:
We are a gated community of 801 homes. We converted to an automated gate system with cameras 4 years ago. The decision was based primarily on the poor performance by guards from several different companies we tried. The camera system was pretty expensive to install and it took a lot of time, effort and $'s to get it working properly but it now works quite well. The cameras feed a DVR so that we can review footage if there is an issue and they are also remoted to the monitors at our clubhouse front desk. There is a call box linked to a remote operator in case of problems with the transponders.

I am not up on the technical details of what types of equipment are being used but I can put you in touch with the chairman of our gate committee if you want. I do know that we have cameras that read the license plates of cars entering and leaving, even when it is dark.
SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699
Posted:
Quote:
Someone has proposed replacing the guards with 'virtual guards' - actually a remotely operated camera system.


Depends on the neighborhood, crime rate, etc. A real person and cameras is way better than, just a camera system. Criminals typically don't care about cameras. But if you already live in a safe neighborhood, a guard may be an overkill. Depends on your circumstances.
JayP3 (Florida)
Posts: 154
Posted:
"It should never come down to dollars.

Decisions should be based on what is the best value for the money being spent and in the best interest of the Association."

Huh?

"Value of the money being spent...".

That's not dollars?
LarryB13 (Arizona)
Posts: 4,099
Posted:
Peter,

Right now you have your own employees manning the gates. If they have been on the job more than a week, they probably know a lot - or maybe even all - of your residents. They know who belongs. They may even know that the woman in the blue minivan does not live there but checks up daily on her mother, who does live there.

Will you get that same level of service from someone in a call center? Your members may like the idea of saving money until they are refused entry by some nameless remote operator.

What percentage of your budget is consumed by the guards at the gate? I ask because sometimes it is too easy to get caught up in the numbers without putting them into context.

You mentioned that your current employees are licensed. Do the call center operators also need a license and are they licensed?
PaulT6 (California)
Posts: 409
Posted:
I wish I was able to afford to live in a gated community. In our 6,400 property HOA, with about 80% part timers, and public streets, the thieves just watch to see who are part timers and help themselves. Suggest you keep live people at the gate. As mentioned by Steve, cameras are less of a deterrent. Save money somewhere else. Once the thieves find out you are less secure they will keep coming back.

Paul T
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Paul

The issue with your community is it is known for "empty" houses. That is a magnet for thieves.

Once lived in a very upscale town that had an interstate highway running through it on one edge of town. 80% of all home breakins happened within 1/2 mile of the Interstate. Yes 80% and it was not the more expensive part of town. Simply based on ease of access. Quick off/on the interstate.

While different basic issues.....same bottom line.

PaulT6 (California)
Posts: 409
Posted:
John,

Exactly right, we tried the "Neighborhood Watch" routine but it failed miserably. I watch my part timer neighbors houses but it is basically "easy pickings" for the bad guys. Our HOA and our Town Police Dept try to do a "media blitz" once in a while but it is like whistling into the wind, if you get my drift.

Paul T
JimH21 (Florida)
Posts: 4
Posted:
So, what was the verdict? Did you ever get the Virtual Gate Guard and, if so, what do you think of it?

Do you own the equipment?

Who is handling the Visitors and what are their qualifications/training? Where are these remote people?

What happens if the internet/power goes down?

How do you register/ call in guests?

How long does it take a guest to be addressed and for the visitor to get through the gate?

Anyone???
AlanE3 (Texas)
Posts: 3
Posted:
What callbox operator service are available. I am looking for one.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Say, Jim of FL and Alan of TX, it's usually better to start a new thread so we don't have to wade through old stuff. Ask specific questions to us.

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