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Subject: Painting
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Author Messages
AB3
(Arizona)

Posts:44


02/20/2008 5:43 PM  
I would like to know out of the communities that are or have adopted new paint colors within the last 2 years are choosing to paint the house in a dark color and trim in a lighter color?

I'm just curious if this dark house light trim is how the majority of assocaitions are painting? Because I've seen some houses with the wood trim whited out and it is awful. White washed would be ok but not solid white plus it will yellow and hard to keep clean.

I think that as long as you use the two colors required that the homeowner should be able to paint however they chose in those two colors. At least that way most people are happy. This way you still uniformaity and individuality all in the same community.

I'm just curious how other associations have handled the what to paint what color and if the majority is going with the dark/light trim. Personally light/dark trim looks classier.

How are associations dealing with this issue?
RobertR1
(South Carolina)

Posts:5164


02/20/2008 6:58 PM  
AB3,
I think the surest way to create confusion is to throw open to the Owners what color they want to paint the buildings. Might I suggest any advice you would get here would be meaningless because the color choice is also influence by what the landscape is, what style building and various other factors that a professional designer would know. I would try to get a couple of professional opinions, keep the Board opinion to yourselve and try and get what the majority feels about what the professionals say. That seems to be whjere to start. Also keep the different colors to a minimum, saves lots of trouble if you need to match paint in the future.
DonnaS
(Tennessee)

Posts:5671


02/21/2008 6:06 AM  

AB3,
Do you not have any architectural guidelines or an ARC committee where the paint color must be approved by that committee? If you do not and there are no written restrictions on color selections, then you are out of luck.
I am somewhat bothered by your statement of "Because I've seen some houses with the wood trim whited out and it is awful. White washed would be ok but not solid white plus it will yellow and hard to keep clean." That is sounding like just your personal opinion. I personally disagree with that statement. Different areas of the country paint differently. Here in Florida you see shades of Pink everywhere. Imagine a pink house in the northwest. See where I am going with this? It's all in the eyes of the beholder.
GeraldT4


Posts:1022


02/21/2008 9:42 AM  
AB3 - Being that you are in Arizona, I'd a bit surprised if anyone in Arizona wanted to paint a dark color on a house. The dark colors absorb the sun rather than a light colored house which repels it. The dark color may help in the evening when the sun goes down and the heat retained can transpire into the house, but will not be environmentally friendly during the day when the sun is strongest. Where I'm going with this is that there's a lot more to house color than it's pretty appearance, or personal taste. There are practical considerations on house, and roof color as well as situation of the house in relation to the sun, wind, views, and environment. What works for some in the northeast, is probably irrelevant to you in the southwest. If you are trying to help develop some standards for your community, consider the variables that exist in your neck of the woods. Personal color choice questions, or trends in color choices are for the most part irrelevant particulars on this site. However, the how to's of guidelines are issues we can all assist you with. Are you on a committee, board member, owner? In other words, what is your function in your HOA, perhaps that will further assist us?
AB3
(Arizona)

Posts:44


02/21/2008 6:09 PM  
I hope I didn't offend anyone. That wasn't the intended purpose. I thank you Gerald for your pointing out something that might not been taken into consideration.

Currently I'm new to the board.
Myself as other owners in our community don't like the lighter trim or the white wood. It will not stay clean with the sand storms we have in AZ nor do I want to waste the water to wash them all the time.

I wanted to purpose that the board compromises which, would allow owners to paint using the light house with the darker trim. We only have 2 colors to use. I wanted to suggest to allow the owners to paint however, they wanted as long as they only used the 2 colors approved. This would still give uniformity and individuality. The colors are already selected owners were split down the middle as to the colors to use. This being the case half wants to use a darker trim and half don't. I just wanted to try and make everyone happy including myself.

I didn't know if this was an issue for lots of other associations and how they handled it. There could be reasons why this would be a very bad suggestion to make that I didn't think of. I just wanted to make sure all angles were looked at before making such a suggestion.

That is all.
Don't take it the wrong way. I wasn't trying to step on anyone's toe's. I only want to try and make everyone happy.

Thank you
GeraldT4


Posts:1022


02/22/2008 7:15 AM  
AB3 - You are never going to make everyone happy. It doesn't sound like your association formed an ARC (Architectural Review Committee) to research and provide color recommendations to the Board. Two color choices, one for the trim, and one for the house walls is IMHO going to provide monotonous uniformity for those that choose those particular wall and trim choices, but also provide stark contrast for those that do not. You're also giving owners a chance to paint the walls dark. My thought is to provide an option of light colors and an option of trim colors and if you are amending the cc&r's in that process you may need to get a community vote on the matter.
AB3
(Arizona)

Posts:44


02/22/2008 2:38 PM  
Here's the deal. The committee provided colors how many is unknown to the board and they selected 4 colors. Then they submitted for vote the two options one was a darker house paint than the other. We didn't have a vote on the house color and the trim individually. It was these are the two options you have to select from and that is it. Only having two options to pick from even if you liked neither you still had to pick one. We voted by mail so nobody was even allowed the oppotunities to make any motions or comments.

People were complaining at the annual meeting that they would rather paint using the colors in reverse. Mainly because of having to paint the wood white. Nothing shows age more than discolored white. Then of course I still think of painting like coloring a picture with crayons. Granted opinions are like *** **** everybodies got one.

I just think we have a the chance to turn around the owners thinking about the board. By showing them that we will compromise and allow some individuality instead of treating them like children telling them what color to paint and what to paint what color. When employers are looking for employee's they want someone who is flexible. I seems that previous boards haven't been flexible they have been ruled with an iron fist in all aspects not just violations.

Our community is all by itself most people don't even know it's here. We don't have any homes on either side or in back. In front those houses are ginger bread type houses without an association. We are a totally diffrent style and are isolated for the most part.

Is there any reason why my suggestion or motion would be bad or inappropriate? My being new to the board I don't want people to think I'm dumb. Is there something obvious that I could be missing by suggestioning to allow owners to paint however they want to using the two colors allowed?
RobertR1
(South Carolina)

Posts:5164


02/22/2008 3:39 PM  
AB3,
There is absolutely nopthing wrong with making any motion that you feel will help or improve the association. I don't know why you would think otherwise.

Even if your prior board was a disctatorship, any board has to say enough for too many people wanting to be pleased. Why can't you concern be handled by the Board. All they can say is no. The Board should articulate the process of what they considered when they picked the colors. Someone has to decide, that is why you have a board. I assume they picked the colors for the same reason you want to modify them. They thought it was the most appropriate choise. I think I recommended at the start that you have a professional give you some suggestion and any paint store usually has someone on staff with a lot of experience with your area.
AB3
(Arizona)

Posts:44


02/22/2008 8:43 PM  
First off as I already said I'm new to the board.

I've been sitting on the other side of this for too long. The previous boards have all been very experienced at political double speak. Basically never answering the question then quickly moving to another question.

The colors are set I'm not trying to change the colors or even suggest changing the two colors. Talking to someone at the paint store is irrelevent.

I'm just trying to determine if other boards have allowed such a thing? I'm just looking for something to back up my suggestion.

So, i can say over the years other boards have faced the same situation and have successfully handled it like this. I don't care if you are in AZ or not. I don't care if the colors were the same as ours. I just want to know if you know of any associations where homeowners wanted to paint in the obverse of what they were being told. For example: Painting the house in what the board says should be the trim color then painting the trim in the color they said is to be the house. That is it.

I also wanted to know what were some of the challenges they faced if they did allow it. Did people go crazy and paint the house half one color and half another or something stupid like that. I just want to make sure I have looked at this from all angles and be able to present some kind of support to back it up. I don't even want to know the community's name.

I just want to have my ducks in a row and not go in there unprepared. I want to be able to speak from a point of view that isn't mine. Because after all the board is here to 1)serve the community as a whole and 2)make decisions based on the good of the community. Yes, I don't like the colors either and would rather paint reversing the colors. However, I want to make it clear that I never even had the thought of making this suggestion until some of the other owners complained at the annual meeting. If I'm going to make the suggestion I had better be able to support my arguement. Which is why I'm asking for the information that I am.

There is nothing more and nothing less to it. I just want to have some kind of information to back it up. If you know where I could find such information that is great too. I don't mind doing the work I just thought this I would get more support as well as pros and cons to my question.
RobertR1
(South Carolina)

Posts:5164


02/23/2008 3:00 AM  
Oly,
If you as a Board member make a suggestion at a Board meeting about anything, you are not being argumentive, you are doing you job. If the Board collectively nix'es your suggestion, and you rebut the Board, you then, may need support. Your support is how many people asked you about what you are bringing before the Board.

You ask if anyone else has been faced with this situation, or course they have, and reached a compromised. If you want to give expert advice to the Board you get an experts opinion. You have a suggestion to be made, make you suggestion.

I can certainly say our condo has over the last 18 years has been over paint colors ad naseum, and the latest is to paint all five buildings tropical colors. Cooler heads will prevail and the colors will remain basically the same but the type paint has been changed on the advicee of the irrelevent expert from the paint store or contractor that does the work. I or no one else can make your mind up. We tend to forget that the association, as a whole, is who we are looking out for.

The association decides the color scheme, what ever it is, some will love it, some will hate it, none have the authority to paint the houses differently than the Board directs. Has there ever been a case of an owner painting their house different than directed, of course, no argument prevents that, your the board deal with it, if it happens.

Do you not consider your opinion, and all board members opinion, worthy of consideration? You are owners also. If you don't like the colors, say so. You need the same justification to voice your opinion as everyone else. Your vote may well be something else made by you after considering what you know. I, for one can present some logic learned by experience, but what associations decided what is up to them, isn't it. You are looking for a problem when you have the solution, it is YOUR Boards function to decide this, and take the bows or take the heat and no doubt both. You are in for a long tenure if you are going to expect to be right all the time, but as most board members quickly learn, they have lots less problems if they can provide a united front.

Out of words Oly.
PaulM
(Pennsylvania)

Posts:1347


02/23/2008 5:26 AM  
AB3: Re reversing the 2-chosen paint colors having the dark color on the house, and the trim the light color. You stated that "I want to be able to speak from a point of view that isn't mine." However, until you show proof otherwise to them, that will be exactly what you are doing since this reverse of color is what you desire.

Therefore, IF indeed you do have many association residents who feel that is the choice they want to make to reverse colors, then do the work and get their names on a petition and present it to the Board. There is safety in numbers, and numbers go far when a decision is to be made.

As a caution, be careful what you wish for. I would investigate the surrounding area for this type of reverse color choice to see if it is desirable and aesthetically correct for your own neighborhood association.





GeraldT4


Posts:1022


02/23/2008 6:06 AM  
Posted By AB3 on 02/22/2008 2:38 PM
Here's the deal. The committee provided colors how many is unknown to the board and they selected 4 colors. Then they submitted for vote the two options one was a darker house paint than the other. We didn't have a vote on the house color and the trim individually. It was these are the two options you have to select from and that is it. Only having two options to pick from even if you liked neither you still had to pick one. We voted by mail so nobody was even allowed the oppotunities to make any motions or comments.

People were complaining at the annual meeting that they would rather paint using the colors in reverse. Mainly because of having to paint the wood white. Nothing shows age more than discolored white. Then of course I still think of painting like coloring a picture with crayons. Granted opinions are like *** **** everybodies got one.

I just think we have a the chance to turn around the owners thinking about the board. By showing them that we will compromise and allow some individuality instead of treating them like children telling them what color to paint and what to paint what color. When employers are looking for employee's they want someone who is flexible. I seems that previous boards haven't been flexible they have been ruled with an iron fist in all aspects not just violations.

Our community is all by itself most people don't even know it's here. We don't have any homes on either side or in back. In front those houses are ginger bread type houses without an association. We are a totally diffrent style and are isolated for the most part.

Is there any reason why my suggestion or motion would be bad or inappropriate? My being new to the board I don't want people to think I'm dumb. Is there something obvious that I could be missing by suggestioning to allow owners to paint however they want to using the two colors allowed?




AB3 - Let me get this right : ) Your community voted for one of two options, or voted that these are the two options to choose from? Options are 1) Lighter house color and trim 2) Darker house color and trim One of those options had a white trim color? Is this correct, if so, which house color (lighter or darker) had the white trim?

Now, look to your Certificate of Incorporation and governing documents in their entirety. If yours is like mine, YOUR motioning to undue the community vote may very well be out of order. Let me quote from my Cert. of Inc. "Unless Owners representing at least fifty (50%) percent of all votes entitled to be cast request such a meeting, no special meeting may be called to consider any matter which is substantially the same as a matter voted upon at any meeting of the Owners held during the preceding twelve (12) months, which determination shall be made in the sole and absolute discretion of the Board of Directors.".

The importance here is that follow the recommendation of a previous post to gather your supporters in favor of different options. Understand of course that you may be insulting the committee and Board in questioning the community vote and effort it took to get as far as the community did.

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