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RichardT
(South Carolina)

Posts:3

10/11/2006 12:17 PM
our bi-laws prohibit the use of any unit for commercial activities of any character. if i have a home office in my unit. i work in another state 4 days of the week. i do bring work home with me, i am a archetect. am i violating this bi-law? i do not advertise my business, nor do i do business in this state.

HaroldS
(Arizona)

Posts:904

10/11/2006 2:44 PM
Richard - only the nittiest of the nitpickers would cite you. Anyway, how would they know what you do in your home? I suppose you generate no excess traffic, noise or odors that would clue them in. Supposedly the inside of our homes are still sacred - for the time being maybe. Just to be safe, I wouldn't discus this with any neighbors - you just never know. Do a search here for home office, home business, etc. This has been discussed just recently. Harold

CharlesW1
(Georgia)

Posts:821

10/11/2006 5:01 PM
Richard, I too would have to be of the same opinion with Harold. They couldn’t possible know you are doing business out of your home office or what your doing in it. It isn’t like you are generating an unnecessary amount of traffic into your home. That is what this by-law is attempting to avoid! Chuck W.

Charles E. Wafer Jr.

BrianB
(California)

Posts:1748

10/11/2006 5:57 PM
It depends on the exact wording of your covenants, but i suspect that yes, you are technically in violation. Most codes were either written long before the idea of cell phones, email, wireless networking, and stay at home workers were popular, or were written (badly) with the intent to keep cars, delivery vans, traffic, etc. to a minumum (ie, not disrupt the quiet life of the neighborhood). However, we have the same badly worded rule in our HOA, and as i sit here in my kitchen and answer this question, i am taking a break from re-editing my first novel, which i hope to sell and publish... which would be a violation of our rules against running any type of business from my home. Join the club!

DonN
(Michigan)

Posts:242

10/11/2006 6:57 PM
I am not an attorney so this is not legal advice. The answer to the question may depend upon the wording in the CC&Rs for your CID. My reading of the literature is that "for residential purposes" is generally given a broad meaning by the courts and allows home business as long as there are no external commercial activities: signs, vehicles parked, vehicles coming and going, no parking of commercial vehicles, etc. If the residence has the look and feel of a residence, it is a residence even though busines may be done within.

Don Nordeen Governance of Property Owners Associations

BradP
(Kansas)

Posts:1742

10/12/2006 12:40 PM
Richard: To me the intention of the rule sounds like they want to eliminate home businesses. I bet if you your community there are a lot of people who bring work home or work from home on occassion, heck knows I do cause I don't want to be at work sometimes. I would even question is that is the definition of a commercial activity anyway. I wouldn't worry about it, who is going to know and who is that nitpicky to turn it in.

BrianB
(California)

Posts:1748

10/12/2006 6:20 PM
Brad, to answer your two questions: Who will know/Who will nitpick it? Everyone, trust me. Especially the neighbor who is getting violation letters about his lawn, landscape, cars, etc. that guy will make it a mission to find out who else in the HOA is "breaking a rule" and getting away with it. If you ever talk to a neighbor about your life, your work, etc., invite them into your home (oh, excuse the mess here, I am swamped with tax season work), etc., then everyone knows you work from home. the problem neighbor will turn you in, and sit back and refuse to deal with his issues until the board deals with your home business. there's one in every neighborhood.

BradP
(Kansas)

Posts:1742

10/13/2006 11:51 AM
Brian: Very true, but to me there is a difference in working at home for your job and conducting a commercial enterprise our of your home. I would be very interested in seeing an hoa try to prevent people from working at home, it goes into the category of a rule that is not reasonable. If it has zero impact on neighbors, then there should be no issue. For example, what has your writing a book done to your neighbors? Nothing, but I do understand there is one of those people everywhere.

CynthiaD
(Nevada)

Posts:20

10/16/2006 10:02 AM
Check with your local ordinances City, County as well for restrictions on home businesses. Of course, if the business is illegal, such as operating without a business license or other proper licensing, any statute--Federal, state or local--would take precedence over any community documents. What needs to be determined is what was the developer/declarant's intent in the recorded documents as far as "commercial activity" is concerned? Has your community ever enforced this "rule" before, as in "past precedence" and if so, did they issue a fine and/or a cease and desist order? In my opinion, I think the usual idea and intent of a developer would be: not have excessive traffic on your community streets, no blocking or using your neighbors' available parking spaces, "outsiders" coming in and out of the community, large commercial vehicles, like landscape trucks carrying debris that may end up in the community, dust from cement trucks, the weight of heavy vehicles on association paid for streets when they were not designed for nor budgeted in the reserves to maintain that kind of traffic, or having a day care with kids being dropped off and picked up or end up outside if unsupervised, this could pose a potentially serious liability issue. Talk to your insurance agent and your association's insurance agent. Depending on the type of business activity, what to consider is, would this activity impose a health, welfare or safety issue or create any kind of liability to yourself, your business, on your own homeowner's or business policy or the community's policy? I disagree with the "what they don't know won't hurt you" and "if you don't get caught" attitude. Be reasonable as another person in a like position would act. If no harm, no foul, one would think there would be no problem. Unless someone complains. There's one in every neighborhood that has little else to do except find fault in others. It is unfortunate many legal association documents aren't written in plain explicit language. Read them carefully.

BethG
(California)

Posts:6

10/16/2006 10:44 AM
I am an attorney but this is still not to be construed as legal advice. Some state courts have found that HOAs cannot enforce commercial restrictions against home based businesses without outward evidence of the business. Sometimes Boards violate privacy laws when they strive to find out what someone is doing in their home. On the other hand, sometimes owners taunt HOA Boards by doing things like setting up their garage for a home office, pushing their vehicles out into already crowded common area parking spaces. If you do not advertise, have signs, invite extra traffic (foot or vehicular), or have any outward evidence of the business in the association, it seems to me like the Board should have better things to do than come after you. But I urge you to check with legal counsel in your state and see if their are any cases that support your position. Beth Grimm

Beth A. Grimm Official HOATalk.com Sponsor Attorney Licensed in the State of Calfornia www.CaliforniaCondoGuru.com *See legal notice below (end of page) or go to www.hoatalk.com/legal

ClaudeV
(Florida)

Posts:84

10/16/2006 4:43 PM
The inside of your home IS SACRED...period. If you have no outward signs of doing work in the privacy of your home, as mentioned by others above, it is none of anyone's business what you do inside your home. If an HOA can govern you INSIDE the privacy of your home, then they have way too much power and way too much time on their hands! Besides, it's unconstitutional for them to even attempt it unless you are manufacturing illegal drugs or conducting some other "illegal" activity. If it's "legal"...they have no say. Period.

BrianB
(California)

Posts:1748

10/16/2006 7:11 PM
Claude, while I agree with your sentiment, that doesn't make it legal. In fact, when a person signs on the dotted line and buys into an HOA, they agree to allow the HOA access to just as much of their life as the CC&R's say they can have. So yes, the HOA CAN enforce things in your home, if you agreed to it when you purchased. Several examples: the home office. Pets. Certain electronic equipment. Car maintenance. renting. Number of boarders/people living in home. All of these have been, and/or can be agreed upon in the contract you sign with the HOA, and thus, are contractually enforceable. When you purchase a home with deed restrictions, you have entered into a binding contract, and thus, are stuck with the terms of that contract... be it no home office, no loud music, no amplifiers, no pets, no cats, no birds/pigs/snakes, no renting, no live in friends, etc... Caveat Emptor

BradP
(Kansas)

Posts:1742

10/18/2006 6:11 AM
Brian has a good point. However, in this case the key word is commericial. What constitutes commercial activity? I am not the smartest tool in the shed but I would argue that doing work for my job in my house while not bothering someone is not a commercial activity.

ClaudeV
(Florida)

Posts:84

10/18/2006 11:43 AM
Brian, Perhaps I was being "too general". Sorry. Our HOA is as about restrictive as one can be and remain "reasonable". There IS a limit on pets and their number & size. No working on cars etc. (However, if your property is privacy fenced or you have a garage, what you do "quietly" behind the fence or inside the closed garage is not an issue to the HOA.) Operating a "business" is prohibited ---->IF, said business is visible from the outside of your home OR you have obvious clients/customers coming and going all the time. That is only "reasonable". We have a home office, TWO in fact. One my wife works out of for her company. They have no "brick & mortar" operation where we live so she works out of our home. Our second office is mine and for family/recreational use. Although I do dabble in Ebay from time to time. Sometimes, quite a lot too! Neither use is an issue with the HOA. I estimate that there are at least 12 to 15 "home offices" in our community of 86 homes that people work out of everyday. If it weren't for the fact that no one tries to hide that fact, no one would "know" that they exist. And frankly, no one in THIS community cares. Now, I'm certain if someone was running a massage parlor or a bingo hall in their homes, THEN that would be an issue. What it boils down to is commonsense and reasonability of the CC&R's. HOA's are supposed to be a "binding influence" among like minded people....NOT some Nazi police force that micro-manages every aspect of the owner's lives. Too many HOA's are run by BOD's that either don't know what the Hell they are doing OR they DO know what they are doing and they like to hold power over other people. WHICH kind of HOA do YOU belong to? Eh? ;-) And as a side note: We have a few folks, 5 or 6, that are "anti-HOA's". WHY in the world they ever purchased property in an HOA governed community in the first place is beyond me! They need to have lots out in the country somewhere so they can do anything they please. They do not belong in an HOA community. A couple of these "libertine rebels" want to destroy our HOA because THEY don't want to obey the rules. They laugh at assessments and law suits/judgements. Their public records show that they have done the same thing in other HOA commnuities they lived in and stiffed them for hundreds of dollars. Afterwards, they just sold and moved. But I want to keep this on topic and this is a matter for another thread.

BrianB
(California)

Posts:1748

10/18/2006 6:57 PM
Claude, I am curious as to the logic used to regulate the number of pets inside my home, but that same logic cannot be used to regulate the business(es) i run from inside my home. Why is it HOA business that I have three dogs and six cats inside my home, but not their business that I have a home office? Aren't both "inside my castle"? Any thoughts?

ClaudeV
(Florida)

Posts:84

10/19/2006 4:45 AM
Posted By BrianB on 10/18/2006 6:57 PM Claude, I am curious as to the logic used to regulate the number of pets inside my home, but that same logic cannot be used to regulate the business(es) i run from inside my home. Why is it HOA business that I have three dogs and six cats inside my home, but not their business that I have a home office? Aren't both "inside my castle"? Any thoughts? Brian, I didn't "make" the rules we have, nor did I say I even agree with all of them. That is our rules. I would have to say that the number and size of pets is an issue if the extreme was created by someone and noise and/or odor became an issue. More than likely, the rules are "general" so as to prevent that "one", (you said it yourself, "there's always one"), that wishes to push the envelope of commonsense. Additionally, I believe the rule on "size" is to deter families from having huge breeds or aggressive breeds that could become a potential threat to other neighbors, such as Pit Bulls or other historically "aggressive" breeds. (I'm a dog person, so I already know that it's how a dog is raised that counts more than the "bloodline" when it comes to being a threat to people.) The point is: I believe, (Just in MHO..ok!), that some "rules" are ambiguous or vague on purpose so they can be used to control the "exceptions" rather than the average person. The average person wouldn't even note those rules because they wouldn't ever apply to them. But you & I know that "some people" have nothing better to do than to be contrary and LOOK for something to be confrontational about. As far as the "home office" question is concerned, which was the purpose of this thread, for example: A person is running a "home hair salon", (and MANY women do that), which means "customers" are in and out of the house, parking on the streets etc all day long during the "business hours" of such an operation. Something of that nature would be cited as a violation. Conversely, you or I run an "Ebay business" from our computer. Everything conducted is inside the home and not even noticable, let alone "intrusive" to anyone else....There is no comparison to the home hair salon business, since there is no "traffic" coming and going. None of us have to LIKE any rule or restriction. If enough of the membership doesn't LIKE a rule or restriction, we have the perogative to attend meetings and floor a motion for a vote that it be changed or eliminated. If we have support enough to accomplish that, GREAT! If not, we LIVE WITH IT or MOVE OUT. It's pretty much that simple. My wife and I didn't move into an HOA community "in spite" of the rules, we moved into an HOA community BECAUSE of the rules. IMHO, if ANYONE moves into a HOA community, KNOWING in advance that they HATE RULES and RESTRICTIONS, then they shouldn't have purchased a home in that community in the first place! If that is their position, then IMHO again, they should place their home up for sale and move out to a non-HOA location.

CharlesW1
(Georgia)

Posts:821

10/19/2006 5:54 AM
Claude, Well worded, my thoughts exactly! I couldn’t have said it any better. Good post. I too believe that many of the rules and regulation stated in most CC&Rs are very vague and left open for interpretation. That’s just my opinion though. Chuck W.

Charles E. Wafer Jr.

BrianB
(California)

Posts:1748

10/19/2006 10:01 AM
my problem with vague interpretations is just this: Let's say we we have a rule that says no businesses, and no dogs in the homes. But, we have two neighbors, one with a small dog that stays inside or in their block fenced back yard, and another running a property management company from home. By the logic stated here, and vague interpretations, we would fine the person with a dog in their home, but it is none of our business about the home business, although neither one exhibits any visibility outside. doesn't seem fair.

RogerB
(Colorado)

Posts:3725

10/19/2006 10:19 AM
The solution when deciding what rules to enforce is to use sound business judgement. Don't try to enforce a rule which would have no legal standing. If you can't see, hear, smell, nor are otherwise affected then do you think 'no home business' would be legally enforced by a judge? And would any Board member of sound mind want to spend thousands to find out?

Roger Borcherding Official HOATalk.com Sponsor DARCO Property Management (Colorado) (303) 925-0150 *See legal notice below (end of page) or go to www.hoatalk.com/legal

ClaudeV
(Florida)

Posts:84

10/19/2006 11:27 AM
Posted By BrianB on 10/19/2006 10:01 AM my problem with vague interpretations is just this: Let's say we we have a rule that says no businesses, and no dogs in the homes. But, we have two neighbors, one with a small dog that stays inside or in their block fenced back yard, and another running a property management company from home. By the logic stated here, and vague interpretations, we would fine the person with a dog in their home, but it is none of our business about the home business, although neither one exhibits any visibility outside. doesn't seem fair. Brian, it kinda boils down to what Roger said and what I said before, (maybe you missed it) What it boils down to is commonsense and reasonability of the CC&R's. HOA's are supposed to be a "binding influence" among like minded people....NOT some Nazi police force that micro-manages every aspect of the owner's lives. Too many HOA's are run by BOD's that either don't know what the Hell they are doing OR they DO know what they are doing and they like to hold power over other people. WHICH kind of HOA do YOU belong to? For ANY CC&R to be enforced, there USUALLY has to be a "complaint" from someone. THEN, said complaint has to be justified and well founded, meaning someone is being bothered in some way OTHER than "just knowing" that someone is in "technical violation" of some vague CC&R. Again, Which type of HOA do YOU belong to? ;-)

BrianB
(California)

Posts:1748

10/19/2006 11:45 AM
my concern is this: If i have a rule that states "No X", and we don't enforce it, how can we defend the enforcement of any other rule that states "No Y"... isn't the non enforcement of a rule pretty damning evidence to a judge that the HOA is selectively enforcing it's rules and regs? There's another thread that references a woman being fined for leaving ice chests in her driveway, while other owners are leaving picnic tables in their driveway without fines. How can a board hope to enforce some rules, and ingore others? How can I, as a board member, fine Owner #1 for weeds in his lawn, but I won't fine Owner #2 for running a home based business from his home, when both are against the rules? Keep in mind, the rules say nothing about "visible to others", they say "no home businesses".

ClaudeV
(Florida)

Posts:84

10/19/2006 11:50 AM
BrianB, I appreciate what your saying but it is all semantics in the end. There is either a legal case because of a legitimate complaint or it's not. Frankly, I wouldn't get anymore gray hairs over contemplating ALL the "what if's" in the world. It's bad for your mental health! ;-) Roger's answer was pretty cut to the chase: Make sound business decisions and most of your percieved horrors will never come to parition. :-)

WilliamT
(Arizona)

Posts:489

10/19/2006 12:02 PM
I believe that a board needs to look at the intent of a rule such as no home based businesses, as well as the current times. Millions of people today have home based businessess such as internet sales, and if they didn't tell anyone, no one would know their business exists. Also, may people do their work at home instead of going to the office. I believe that's called telecommuting. They are in effect running a portion of a business out of their home, but it is invisible to the community. On the other hand a contractor may have a home based business and store material in the garage and have workers in trucks come twice a day to pick up material get work orders, and return with reports at the end of the day. That is a blatant violation because it creates excess trafic on privately maintained streets, and in some cases may create excessive noise. In our community there is a no-business covenent. Before buying our home I spoke with the in-house property manager about this because I have an internet business. She told me that as long as I did not create extra traffic on the private streets there would be no problem, because there are many home based business in the 2000 home community. I load my car with any packages to be mailed while it is in the garage so it is not visible to the neighbors and go to the post office or Fed Ex about 3 times a week. Because I like to save gas, I combine those trips with other home type chores. Occassionally I have a UPS or Fed Ex delivery, and they are in our area each day anyway. I do not do any direct sales out of my home. No one is allowed to come here and pick up anything that they ordered from the web site. So my business is virtually invisible, and that is the way I like it anyway, and it also complies with the "intent" of the covenent.

BrianB
(California)

Posts:1748

10/19/2006 1:08 PM
I guess what I am saying claude is that the semantics state (in our rules, at least) NO home businesses. it says nothing about excess traffic, visible to others, creating a nuisance, etc.. Just "NO". I tend to assume that if the authors wanted to allow businesses to exist that didn't cause traffic, etc., they would have written the rules that way. Instead, they outlawed ALL home businesses. And if our board refuses to enforce this clear rule, then how can it turn around and enforce a rule about "no boats in driveway"? How do i defend against the charge "why do you selectively enforce rules? Why don't you enforce ALL the rules equally? Why do you pick and choose what rules to enforce? How come Bob violates section 11.1 (no businesses in homes), and you don't fine him, but I violate section 12.1 (no more than three pets), and you fine me?" Again, does not enforcing one rule weaken the board defense against enforcing others? Does the board get to pick and choose what rules to enforce?

ClaudeV
(Florida)

Posts:84

10/19/2006 4:57 PM
Brian, I have no answer that you want to hear or that you will understand, obviously. Equating boats in a driveway with someone working at a computer in a home office is ludicrous, and frankly, nit picky. We'll just agree to disagree since the scenarios that you pose are the same rationale that our resident "HOA rebel, libertine board buster" uses. Our fellow would argue that the sky is green and the grass is blue! This is an information/help board, not one of those where members get into pi$$ing contests so I'm withdrawing from this thread. Good luck! And may I recommend on my way out that you find a nice NON-HOA community to live in, and if not, please, please do not serve on any BOD's. Spare your neighbors the grief. :-) :-) No hard feelings...ok?

BrianB
(California)

Posts:1748

10/19/2006 5:16 PM
no hard feelings claude, none at all. the debate does everyone good, to show the sides, traps, pitfalls of each arguement, for and against. and sadly, i am not only in an HOA, i am the president for life of one...

ClaudeV
(Florida)

Posts:84

10/20/2006 2:40 PM
Posted By BrianB on 10/19/2006 5:16 PM no hard feelings claude, none at all. the debate does everyone good, to show the sides, traps, pitfalls of each arguement, for and against. and sadly, i am not only in an HOA, i am the president for life of one... One last post: Brian, you have my sincerest sympathies! Peace brother! :-)

KathyS
(California)

Posts:142

10/21/2006 6:26 AM
I want to add to Brian's train of thought here. The CC&R's and rules are just that. There is no room for interpretation or one is less important than another. CC&R #1 is nit picky while CC&R #2 must enforced? Who's governing documents give less importance to one than another? We are not the US Government Judicial system giving felony status to one violation of the law while misdemeanor status to another. In the eyes of the governing documents, all violations are felonies and all violations should be treated equally. Although I will agree entirely about the home office theory, no traffic, no business, the fact remains it is against the CC&R's. Running with the boat scenerio, it's not ok just because it's visible? I might be considered the HOA rebel, libertine Board buster in my association because of those thoughts. But, fair is fair. Mr. Jones can't have his office if I can't have my boat. If it's a CC&R, no Board should be able to say it's not enforceable for any reason. (Unless illegal or uneforceable by law). This is what causes problems in HOA's. You can, I can't. He got a variance but I can't have one. My suggestion would be, if times have changed and the CC&R and rule are now nit picky, have it removed by a vote of the membership. But while you are at it, have all the CC&R's and rules voted on, not just the ones the Board doesn't want to enforce anymore.

WilliamT
(Arizona)

Posts:489

10/22/2006 7:56 AM
I believe when we look at the CC&R's we must consider several things. 1. The letter of the covenent 2. The intent of the covenent 3. Does the covenent require clarification 4. Is is clarified in the Rules and Regulations 5. Is it an outdated rule, not consistent with todays world 6. Would a judge consider the covent reasonable. Examine these two covenents using those 5 elements: 1. No parking on the street 2. No home based businesses No parking on the street. The letter of the covenent is quite clear, there is to be no parking on the streets. That means homeowners, guests, landscapers, house cleaners, window washers, and any other domestic help. The intent is most likely to keep the streets clear for child safety, street cleaners, emergency vehicle passage, and possibly minimize some wear and tear on the streets. Clarification: Yes some clarification is required, because it is impossible to expect landscapers with their trailers to not park on the streets. Also, if the homeowner is parking in the driveway there is no space for maids and other domestic help to park off the street. And it could force owners to allow people with bad oil leaks to park on their driveway. If one has a party with 10 guest cars in attendance, they can't all fit in a driveway. They're going to park on the street. The rule is not outdated, but does require clarification. A judge would most likely find the covenent reasonable, unless the HOA tried to fine an owner for their guests or domestic help parking in the street. Therefore, it is impossible to enforce that covenent by the "letter" of the rule. It can only be enforced by the "intent", which must be reasonable. What the HOA finds reaonable doesn't count in court. In court, it's what the judge finds reasonable that counts. Any attorney will make that statement. No home based businesses The "letter" of the covenent is clear, that no one shall have home based business. The "intent" of the covenent in most cases, is to prevent a visible commercial business from operating in a residential area, and to prevent excess traffic and noise on the privately maintained streets. A masonry contractor who has four trucks arriving in the morning and late afternoon is creating extra traffic and extra wear and tear on the streets. It is also creating extra noise, by loading and unloading vehicles, and possibly with the workers playing loud radios like they do on their construction sites. Their vehicles will not fit in the driveways of the homeowner so they will be parking on the streets, a clear violation of the no parking covenent, because they are not even supposed to be in the community. Does the covenent require clarification? Yes it does. And the Rules and Regulations is the place to clarify. One cannot add to or subtract from the covenent in the CC&R's, but it certainly can be clarified. The Rule should state that the purpose of the rule is to maintain peace and quite in the community and to prevent excess traffic on the streets, and any appearance of a commercial business being operated from a home. It can also state that a business that is operated only with the home owners, such as a home consulting business with no clients visiting the home, with no employees that come to, or work in the home, or an internet sales business where no sales are picked up by buyers at the residence, and which is invisible to all neighbors, so that no one would know by outword appearances that there is a home based business, does not violate the intent of the covenent. The "letter" of this "no home based business" rule is outdated, and not consistent with todays world. In most cases it was written prior to the large influx of home based computer operated businesses that are invisible to the community. Ours was written 20 years ago when it would take an air cooled room with two computer techs to maintain the equivalent of the desk top computer many of us have in our office today. I have an internet business and there are only two neighbors on my steet that know it exists, and that is because they are friends that I have discussed it with. I don't want people to know about my business. My next door neighbor has an Information Technology Consulting business. He runs it from his home office, on his computer and telephone. I only know about it because he told me. There is never any traffic to his home. Another neighbor a block away runs a Medical Billing Service. It is a full time job and is how she makes her living. It is all done on her computer and telephone. Most of her clients are in another state where she moved from. Only her friends know that she runs a business from her home because there is no traffic. Another is a CPA who works full time from her home, and does not generate any traffic. Another runs a catering business from her home. She has a storage facility a few miles away where her catering supplies are stored, and where her staff meets. But the operation is run from her home computer and telephone, without any traffic to her home. Would a judge consider the "no home business" covent reasonable? If an HOA attempted to fine either myself or the other residents for running an invisible home based business, I believe any judge would say that it is unreasonable. A BOD can make policies and variances for specific things such as invisible home based businesses, and can clarify them in the Rules and Regulations until such time as the CC&R can be amended to change the "letter" of the covenent to be in line with the "intent", and today's virtual world of telecommuting and home based invisible businesses. As I mentioned before, our 2000 home community with an excellent BOD and a professional in-house property manager and staff, have stated verbally that as long as a business does not generate extra traffic and noise, that it is permited, notwithstanding that the "letter" of the CC&R states "no home based businesses". Before I bought my house here, I got that clarification because it concerned me. Fortunately, this professional manager, and the BOD understood the intent of the covenent, and are enforcing it accordingly. I'm on the BOD of a sub community of this larger master community. Our CC&R's can be more restrictive than the master, but not less restrictive. Most of ours are actually in line with the master. Our sub community BOD works to enforce our covenents evenly and fairly, and in doing so we respect the "intent" of the no home based business covent, and we believe it would hold up in court if we were to fine a visible business that was creating extra traffic and noise on the streets we have to maintain, and did not fine an invisible business. In fact, how would we know that an invisible business exists? As president of our BOD, I am still required to comply with our CC&R's, and I do. Is the BOD going to come into my house to see if I have an in house business that has no ourward appearance? Is the BOD going to go into my neighbors house and check his computer to see if he has a business operating on there? Of course not because that would be both illegal, and unreasonable.

ClaudeV
(Florida)

Posts:84

10/22/2006 8:43 AM
WilliamT, Thank You for bringing a voice of reason and applicability of these kinds of CC&R's. When anyone moves into an HOA community they DO, to some extent, sign away some of their "freedoms" of property ownership in so much as they agree to abide by the CC&R's. I have always interpreted that as "abide by the CC&R's within reason". As you pointed out, the final authority for any such disputes would be a mediator, arbitrator or a judge. Any of those would use a "reasonable man standard" which would preclude anyone being in violation for conducting an "invisible" home business or other "reasonable" activity that "could" be construed as a "technical violation" of some vague CC&R. As we all know, everything that is "right" is not always legal and everything that is "legal" isn't always right. That is why we have the civil court system. I believe, personally, that many of the horror stories I have heard about HOA's being led by a bootstrap BOD is because the BOD either doesn't know what they are doing or they DO know what they are doing and hope no one will challenge them because they have some "letter of the law" on their side via the CC&R's. The intent of rules should be fairly plain to everyone with any commonsense at all. The opposite of that statement speaks for itself. HOA's, IMHO, should be a "biding entity" of a community and NOT a divisive tool to be used by unqualified or vindictive BOD's. Hence the word "community". Many people have no idea, or have forgotten, what "community" means. An HOA need not be "adversarial" unless people want it to be. There is always a sane, reasonable way for adults in a disagreement to come to an understanding or compromise. It is sad that too many times it takes an outside entity such as a mediator/arbitrator or a judge to make them see the light.

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