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GraceH
(Virginia)

Posts:224

04/10/2009 5:22 PM
Mary Thank you again for all of your help! All of you have been so much help!

RuthF1
(Washington)

Posts:117

04/10/2009 9:25 PM
I have another question. Isn't it the board who approves the meeting minutes? The secretary told me she sent the minutes to the PM for approval. I thought that was the boards job. Also the PM told the Secretary to leave out anything in regard to the election of officers as it might look like the board is in fighting. My position is that you just put the facts in so there is transperancy to the owners on what is going on. I also realized we did not have the meeting minutes from the annual meeting held in February. According to our bylaws the first meeting to elect officers should have occured within 10 days of the annual meeting. In the past they always did this at the annual meeting after they adjorned. I asked the Secretary to add the following to the meeting minutes. Let me know if you feel this is not necessary or is over the top. The names have been changed to protect the innocent except for mine as I am far from innocent .: Officers picked at the annual meeting Ruth Fletcher (me) President Terrie M VP Sherry S Secretary Jack G Treasure Angie W Member at Large ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ April 2, 2009: This was the first meeting after the annual meeting held on February 5,2009 due to Jana/MacPhersons being on vacation and the BODs deciding not to have a March meeting. Jack G,made a motion that Terrie M be president, Angie W VP, Jack G Treasure, Sherry S Secretary, Ruth Fletcher Member at large. Jack cited the Bylaws stating that we were to choose our officers at the first meeting held after the annual meeting. Ruth Fletcher stated that she thought the officers had been decided at the annual meeting as nothing had been said regarding a second election process. Two other BODs stated they thought the same. Terrie M declined the presidency stating she didn’t want the position. After a lengthy discussion Ruth Fletcher asked for a vote. The motion was made, 2, nay, 2 yay and one abstaining. Motion carried that the officers keep the original positions they were holding Pro Tem. Ruth Fletcher asked the Secretary to include this motion and results in the meeting minutes. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ April 7, 2009: Due to Jana/MacPhersons missing the first meeting on April 2nd the BODs moved to have another meeting with Jana in attendance to make sure we covered everything. Jack G revisited the election of officers by making a motion that he (Jack G) be president, Terrie M VP, Angie W Treasure, Sherry S Secretary and Ruth Fletcher Member at Large. Ruth Fletcher stated that she thought this issue was resolved at the first meeting but was told because it was a tie it wasn’t valid. The reason for the re-vote was because it was thought that Ruth wanted to change Property Managers. Jana at this time told the BOD that she and Ruth had spoken and though there were issues in the past that she felt she and Ruth could work together. After some discussion another vote was taken: 2, nay, 3 yay motion carried. Ruth Fletcher asked the Secretary to include this motion and results in the meeting minutes.

MicheleD
(Kentucky)

Posts:4491

04/10/2009 9:51 PM
It doesn't matter what the PM thinks the inclusion of the previous meeting minutes looks like. It's unethical to leave it out. And, unless your documents specify the PM is the "approver of the meeting minutes," then it's also unethical for the board to simply abdicate that responsibility to her. SHE works for YOU, not the other way around!

GraceH
(Virginia)

Posts:224

04/14/2009 4:59 AM
At our Condo board meeting last night, the Pres. had enough when asked questions regarding the PMs contract. Several items listed under job description instead of employment agreement. Heck, he was not even aware that they just signed the PMs new contract. He actually asked when was the last contract renewed. When we said that you just voted on it the other month, he got up and as he made his way to the door, he said that we will have his resignation. The Board member that is the V.P. took over and did a wonderful job. (He is new to the board and had not attended the meetings before his election.) At one point, the PM told one home owner that he was out of order on that he needs to leave. We stated that the Condominium Act says that he is entitled to be here, so the P.M got up, closed her book and said then we will leave. The V.P. said "It is 7:05 and we have some agenda items to go over" For what was probably the first time in her rein, the PM sat down and realized she was an employee. Major step! Major!!!

RobertR1
(South Carolina)

Posts:5164

04/14/2009 5:45 AM
Grace, Major crack.............yeahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!! ASAP ask for a meeting with the new VP. "Smokeum peace pipe", but keep bows and arrows ready. The PM is next, but try and get the "New" board to do that and offer to help. If the Pres resigns, have one of your guys volunteer to be on Board for remainder of the Pres term or next annual meeting, what ever appropriate, in fact when you sit down with VP to talk, sort of insist one of your group be appointed. Who can argue with that...........seriously. The part about letting the new VP sack PM is just because the PM works for the Board, not the owners (you all). You all just keep the pressure on her? If you have not already, send a formal request to the PM that you want to review specific documents, such as receipts and expenditures for a three month period. You should get some idea of how the day to day books are being kept. Not looking for anything suspecious, just looking at how your organization is run day to day. If, in the future, this PM tells anyone they are out of order. One of your group stand up, interrupt the speaker and call a "Point of order", and motion that the room be clear of all non owners as her remarks justify a meeting of Members. Or do I remember she is a member and owns property? In any event, it is still a legitimate point of order and as soon as you get a second, it should be called by the chair for discussion. If so in either case, the PM is completely out of order making any kind of ruling about who is to leave or stay. That is clearly a chair function and she is so far out of bounds, she seems to have some false sense of importance and authority. All this might be a little premature, but the time line seems to fit other stories.

GraceH
(Virginia)

Posts:224

04/14/2009 5:51 AM
Thank you Robert. If you will, please see a new thread titled Aggregate salary. Is there a limit on threads started by one person?

RuthF1
(Washington)

Posts:117

04/14/2009 7:57 AM
Grace that is Awesome. I now know there is hope. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow but it will come one day. This is exactly the outcome I am looking for. I spoke with a HOA sec. from an association near ours. Her advice to me? "RUN" don't look back. No one cares and you will only have grief. What if everyone felt that way .

GraceH
(Virginia)

Posts:224

04/14/2009 8:00 AM
Ruth, Don't run! You are right, where would we end up if everyone had that outlook.

MaryA1

Posts:0

04/14/2009 8:20 AM
Grace & Ruth, Can't help but comment on the "run" or "don't run" philosophies. Grace can easily say "don't run" because she has a group of like-minded members behind her. But, if Ruth is the only one who can see that change needs to be made, then I can understand the advice to "run". If you are the only one who cares or who can see that something needs to change, it will be a long, slow, uphill battle and perhaps not worth the effort in the end. In the long run, IMO, it doesn't do any good if only one person cares enough to be involved.

GraceH
(Virginia)

Posts:224

04/14/2009 8:43 AM
Mary, I respect your answer, however, I did not always have the support I do now. It took talking to neighbors and as time went on, one by one the support has grown. Each resident meeting we have we have adopted the outlook that if one person understands and can contribute more input we have accomplished something.

RuthF1
(Washington)

Posts:117

04/14/2009 8:55 AM
Thanks Mary and that is truly sage advice. Which is why I was on the board 2 years ago and quit. I knew I couldn't change anything with the board that was there. Now I have the support of the owners. They are outraged that I was removed as President and are letting it be known. I guess there is a letter writing campaign to the PM which I am going to make sure the BOD gets copies of each one (why not we get the complaint letters) I had a meek older gentelman come to my home last night at 10 pm becaue he was so distressed about the change. He was looking forward to things getting done and the community coming together. We talked until midnight LOL. One thing it did do is pulled a lot of people out of their apathy. They are already reeling from a large dues increase that was unannounced until one month before it was implemented. Now becuase our landscaping has been run down so bad we may have to do a Special Assessment to fix it. Thank God I am not the president when that is going to happen LOL.... Money makes people get involved. Especially if it is during these economic times.

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