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When board members don't listen

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AB3 (Arizona)
Posts: 44
Posted:


How to get other board members to see that business judgement isn't being used? I try to bring it to thier attention that if this is done we will go over budget by this many thousands of dollars.

They have this belief that the reserve fund just magically appears. I can't figure out what the goal is. Is it to do the opposite of what others want? If we go bankrupt it it 1000 times worse.

How can I get across to them that we are not in a position to be spending the kind of money that we are spending. We don't get a full audit I think for that reason. To keep from being told and having to acknowledge the financial position we are in.

I have no want or desire to spend any of the assocaition funds with the exception of updating the reserve study done in 2005 and a full audit. That is it. In fact I wouldn't care what they spent on anything as long as we don't go over budget.

They seem to think that I some other reason for being on the board. If I did I wouldn't be trying to get them to save money.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
The old "You can lead a Board member to the table but you can't make them think" problem. Keep proposing the things you want done and keep voting your conscience and make them list you in the minutes as opposing the spending. Try to get new blood involved to run against these naysayers and replace them.
Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Sorry hit submit too soon. When they question your motives, turn it around and ask them why they're on the Board if all they want to do is waste money. Remind them of the current financial crisis and appeal to their honor (even people without honor like to believe they have it) to do what is right for the community.
Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
AB3,

I'm not quite sure what you are concerned about. Can you give a bit more info? Spending reserve money has nothing to do with the budget, in that the money doesn't come from the operating account, it comes from the reserve fund. Is the board wanting to use reserve fund monies for operating expenses? Or, does the board want to use reserve funds to make improvements that you don't think are justified? Are you the board treasurer?
AB3 (Arizona)
Posts: 44
Posted:
This is my first year on the board. But in previous years they had spent a large sum of money on normal operating expenses. They were not emergencies they were luxury items. Things that could have waited.

They go way over budget then spend all this reserve money on top of it. Without making a contribution at all in 3 years. Scheduled replacements have gotten put off because of it. I tried to explain the the reserve study was off by as much as 42 to 48% they don't believe me. (Study is from 2005)

Nobody wants to do anything to save money. When you have two bids infront of you that are identical and one is a lot less which one do you pick. The cheaper one right, nope not then they pick the most expensive one. Even after being told of the more than 20,000 over budget it will cause. Plus force us to take money from the reserves to pay for it.

Like I said I could care less what they spent money on provided it stayed within the budget. Provided any repairs were fixing the underlying problems. Which they are not interested in fixing.

I have sent them articles about HOA's in our area. I have tried to explain to them how much inflation has increased in the first half of this year alone. They don't understand or don't want to.

It is just so sad to watch it happen. Am I not communicating on a level of which they understand. My fiance is a bookkeeper by profession and she has even tried to get them to understand but they are just rude to her.

I just don't know how to get them to listen. Like I said I could care less what they spent money on provided we don't go over budget and make the contributions like we are supposed to. They will not even take advantage of rebates offered by the city and state.

How do I get them to listen? One thing effects so many aspects that nothing can be summed up in 2 words. Especially when they don't understand it anyway.

SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
What do other members think when this Board is constantly over budget and using another restricted fund (the Reserves) to cover their a$$?

I can't believe that you are the ONLY voice to speak out. Do you have any support for your concerns?

What has been the reaction at the Annual Meetings where the past year's financial report vs. the approved budget is explained and provided to members?
SidneyP (Florida)
Posts: 302
Posted:
I would think I wrote this if I didn't know better...My Board has done the same thing. They keep firing and hiring new service(7 in 2 1/2 years) people and and MC's(3 in 2 1/2 years) each costing more than the last and each causing us to run way over budget. And they have also taken from our Reserves and NOT funded the Reserves since April of 07. What I just can't under stand is that they live there in the community and are hurting themselves by what they are doing. In fact when we had our meeting the other night, the President and the secretary were both on the delinquent list and were the last time also. We have an attorney who was handling our delinquent accounts, in fact got a letter from him last week but at this meeting they voted to hire another attorney (?) The President said "OH! we didn't hire him the old MC did". The new attorney charges more for everything, I just can't figure her out...When I ask how we were going to pay for all this, her reply, "increase the dues and a "Special assessment". She has to be crazy, we have 14 old delinquencies and as for our July1st dues, we still have 32 who have not paid. 1 over $3000., 2 over $2500., 2 $1500., 3 OVER $1000. right now a total of $25,602. delinquent. I don't know about your HO's but I know ours can't afford to pay much more.

I have written letter after letter to the Board asking them why they were placing the Association in such a hole we will never be able to get out of. I am on the Board now, my vote is NO for increased expense but one Board member can't do much. Our Budget last year was $62,986. of which $5726. was not collected in Jan. plus we were already short for the HO's that didn't paid last July07's either. And so far this year we have spent over 31,000 dollars....Believe me they won't listen, I have tried for the 2 1/2 years the Board has been in charge. You may as well give up until the HO's are presented w/a "Special Assessment" then maybe they will wake up and insist the Board do as the CC&R's and FL SS's direct them to do. Good luck to you, and wish me some too...
BruceF1 (Connecticut)
Posts: 2,535
Posted:
It seems to me that if you have a board that has run amok and has lost all sense of fiscal responsibility, you have three choices:

1. Gather evidence, consult a lawyer and sue the board;

2. Gather support among the homeowners and throw the bums out;

3. Live with it.
AB3 (Arizona)
Posts: 44
Posted:
Bruce it is easier said than done.

Suing the board just makes it worse. Getting 25% is almost impossible. We don't have enough owner involvement. Those that are upset basically get ignored or told they are ranting. I'm begiinning to think they are holding backyard meetings and are being lied too.

When you bring up something that has been an oversight for years like only having 150 homes instead of 155 because 5 of the homes were owned by the builders. Which were build outside the subdivision's property lines. So they don't have to pay dues or abide by the CCRS. You get told crap like why didn't any of the other boards ever notice this? Like I can answer that. My best guess is because nobody reads the CC&Rs most likely.

Living with it isn't fair for everyone else. They don't put out newsletters this year because they don't want anyone to know what is going on.

For those that don't live here full time it is criminal to not keep them informed. For those that live here, we are supposed to act as the majority wants us too. That makes it difficult when we have backyard meetings.

I wouldn't care one little bit if they would stay within the budget and use some intelegence when making decisions. We are just throwing money into a black hole. I'd rather see owners not pay then to give the money to the assocaition and see it be misused. In fact that isn't a bad idea. Bankrupcy would be 20 xs worse than everyone not pay dues for a month or two.

Good luck to you too!! I have to remeber take a deep breath and go to your happy place. Frustration will only age you. It's easy to say however, I haven't been able to practice it yet.
AB3 (Arizona)
Posts: 44
Posted:


To boot we have all these banks going under. The dollar worthless for the most part. The parallel between our federal governement and hoas are amazing.

All to many have the pay as you go plan in place. Make someone else pay for the deterioration to the common elements that they contributed too. Maybe they plan to sell.

If they have to follow Generally Accepted Accounting Principles as ours do. Make sure they are following them.

Go to Ross Perot's website perotcharts.com read the speak by the president of the Dallas Federal Reserve given in May or June. it is scary what has happened to this country and it has trickled down to the hoas.

KirkW1 (Texas)
Posts: 1,665
Posted:
Suing the board should be a last resort as typically the only winners are the lawyers.

A better way is to throw the bums out. Go collect the votes needed to vote them out. But you must find people willing to do the work to replace them. Unfortunately your neighbors don't care enough to do something about the situation.
AB3 (Arizona)
Posts: 44
Posted:
Only if all the owners actually lived here full time is that really an option. In this state 40 to 50% live here 2 or 3 months out of the year. Those owners don't get to worried about the wasteful spending that is a direct result of rising dues. They don't inquire or do much of anything but pay dues unless it affects them directly. Which is the case with most people.

It would have to be court ordered. We have to have 25% of the membership to vote them out. To establish a quorum at the annual meeting we have to use absentee ballots. Small community.

We just have to deal with it. I guess until something or someone discovers something that affects them. Who also has the ear of the people who live here part time. For one reason or another they just will not listen. I recently discovered something that nobody has ever noticed. It's only on the first page of the CCRs. The response I got was Why hasn't anyone else ever noticed this before. Let me see. Because nobody has ever read the CCRs maybe.

Now to boot our bank just got shut down by the FDIC. Our association attorney owned or was on the board of the CAI bank at one point. The association attorney also is one of CAI's top lobby firms. A good 60% maybe more communinties that have mangaement companies use this exact bank because of it's CAI affiliation. How can the CAI endorse a bank that is giving loans to people they know will be foreclosed. My best guess, it just screams that CAI attorneys want you to lose your home or sue the association in one way or another so they can rack up the fees. I think the homes should be given to the purchaser. The bank intentioally put these people in this position for whatever reason. What good did they expect to come out of it? Now people have lost their homes and ruined their credit. Yet the guilty people get to keep their homes.
Maybe this is the beginning of the end for HOA's or is this proof that HOA foreclosures were created for the purpose of attorney profits. It still amazes me that someone agreed and got the support of the government to allow a private debt to a private non-profit group use your home for collateral. Isn't the nature of collateral to secure a loan that is at least worth the same dollar value as the amount of money borrowed. If you borrowed money to buy a car they don't take your house. It would be considered excessive. Yet they will take your home for 2 or 300.00 then rack up the legal costs so your sure to not be able to pay. The insanity.

That is a whole other topic.

MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AB3 on 07/27/2008 12:50 AM
Only if all the owners actually lived here full time is that really an option. In this state 40 to 50% live here 2 or 3 months out of the year. Those owners don't get to worried about the wasteful spending that is a direct result of rising dues. They don't inquire or do much of anything but pay dues unless it affects them directly. Which is the case with most people.

It would have to be court ordered. We have to have 25% of the membership to vote them out. To establish a quorum at the annual meeting we have to use absentee ballots. Small community.

We just have to deal with it. I guess until something or someone discovers something that affects them. Who also has the ear of the people who live here part time. For one reason or another they just will not listen. I recently discovered something that nobody has ever noticed. It's only on the first page of the CCRs. The response I got was Why hasn't anyone else ever noticed this before. Let me see. Because nobody has ever read the CCRs maybe.

Now to boot our bank just got shut down by the FDIC. Our association attorney owned or was on the board of the CAI bank at one point. The association attorney also is one of CAI's top lobby firms. A good 60% maybe more communinties that have mangaement companies use this exact bank because of it's CAI affiliation. How can the CAI endorse a bank that is giving loans to people they know will be foreclosed. My best guess, it just screams that CAI attorneys want you to lose your home or sue the association in one way or another so they can rack up the fees. I think the homes should be given to the purchaser. The bank intentioally put these people in this position for whatever reason. What good did they expect to come out of it? Now people have lost their homes and ruined their credit. Yet the guilty people get to keep their homes.
Maybe this is the beginning of the end for HOA's or is this proof that HOA foreclosures were created for the purpose of attorney profits. It still amazes me that someone agreed and got the support of the government to allow a private debt to a private non-profit group use your home for collateral. Isn't the nature of collateral to secure a loan that is at least worth the same dollar value as the amount of money borrowed. If you borrowed money to buy a car they don't take your house. It would be considered excessive. Yet they will take your home for 2 or 300.00 then rack up the legal costs so your sure to not be able to pay. The insanity.

That is a whole other topic.


First of all, I doubt the CAI bank gave loans that they knew would be foreclosed. The real problem is that loans were given w/o first properly qualifying the people receiving the loan. Many of these people didn't understand what an ARM was and when the interest rate substantially increased they didn't have the money to pay the higher mortgage payment.

Secondly, is Ekmark & Ekmark or Carpenter/Hazelwood your HOA attorney? I don't know of any CAI lobbyists who are also HOA attorneys Curtis Ekmark and Scott Carpenter are the co-chairs of the Leg. Action Comm. of the AZ Central Chapter of CAI. DeMenna & Assoc. is the paid lobbying firm.

Lastly, exactly what do you mean by this statement? "It still amazes me that someone agreed and got the support of the government to allow a private debt to a private non-profit group use your home for collateral."

KirkW1 (Texas)
Posts: 1,665
Posted:
Quote:
Only if all the owners actually lived here full time is that really an option. In this state 40 to 50% live here 2 or 3 months out of the year. Those owners don't get to worried about the wasteful spending that is a direct result of rising dues.

I would think that voting the bums out would be easier then. It would not be as cheap, but it would be relatively easy. You just have to out proxy the current board.

Get a listing of the absentee owners and start contacting them. Tell them that you are trying to bring more financial responsibility to the Board which will equate to lower dues in the end. Given that most don't much care, they will be quite easy to convince to give you their proxy (vote).
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KirkW1 on 07/27/2008 8:06 PM
Only if all the owners actually lived here full time is that really an option. In this state 40 to 50% live here 2 or 3 months out of the year. Those owners don't get to worried about the wasteful spending that is a direct result of rising dues.


I would think that voting the bums out would be easier then. It would not be as cheap, but it would be relatively easy. You just have to out proxy the current board.

Get a listing of the absentee owners and start contacting them. Tell them that you are trying to bring more financial responsibility to the Board which will equate to lower dues in the end. Given that most don't much care, they will be quite easy to convince to give you their proxy (vote).

Kirk,

Sorry! No can do in AZ -- proxies are outlawed. The members have 2 choices: mail-in ballots or voting in person. Any of the "snowbirds" who may not be around at election time can mail their ballots in.
AB3 (Arizona)
Posts: 44
Posted:
MaryA,

Were you going to offer any advice or just try or just show us how wrong you are? Sorry, hun your only partially correct. You are right about AZ not allowing proxies. However, ANY OWNER can vote by absentee ballot and they count for establishing a quorum and on petitions to remove board members. AZ laws give detailed instructions on how to do it. If you don't get enough votes to remove them you can't try again. And orgainizations to help you do it.
Owners addresses are public record just like association financials when it is a non-profit orgainization. It can prove to be expensive when having to mail everyone a petition to sign and a ballot.

The FDIC stated that the CAI bank was closed because they could not show solvency due to fraudulent loans. Look it up OR provide PROOF to support your comments!

The Arizona Republic
Aug. 22, 2007

Arizona's 1st National Bank Holding Co. hit by housing slump
1st National hit by slump Russ Wiles

Scottsdale-based 1st National Bank Holding Co. said it would discontinue its national wholesale-mortgage unit and close mortgage centers in Virginia, North Carolina and Nevada, keeping open just one operations facility, in Tempe.

The layoffs attest to credit problems that have spread from subprime lenders to "Alt-A" financiers such as 1st National. The term refers to loans extended to borrowers with mid-range credit scores who didn't fully document their income or other financial information on loan applications. Those looser underwriting standards now are coming back to haunt many in the industry.

THE FOLLOWING CAME FROM YAHOO.

First National Bank of Nevada, Reno, Nevada, and First Heritage Bank, N.A., Newport Beach, California (owned by First National Bank Holding Company, Scottsdale, Arizona), were closed today by the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency and the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (FDIC) was named receiver. The FDIC entered into purchase and assumption agreements with Mutual of Omaha Bank, Omaha, Nebraska, to take over all of the deposits and certain assets of the First National Bank of Nevada, Reno (also operating as First National Bank of Arizona, which recently merged into it), and First Heritage Bank, N.A., Newport Beach, California.

The Office of the Comptroller of the Currency said in a news release that 1st National was undercapitalized and had experienced substantial dissipation of assets and earnings "due to unsafe and unsound practices."

Those practices "also weakened the bank's condition and seriously prejudiced the interests of the bank's depositors and the deposit insurance fund."

Another news release said First Heritage was critically undercapitalized and was likely to incur losses that would deplete all or nearly all of its capital.

THE FOLLOWING came from the Business Journal
Before taking over First National, Mutual of Omaha Bank had $735 million in assets in banks in Colorado and Nebraska, a relatively small amount compared with other regional banks that have tens of billions of assets. It is acquiring $3 billion in deposits plus $200 million in assets from First National.

Mutual of Omaha Bank is a savings bank and, under federal regulations, must focus on making residential mortgage loans and will not be able to commit as much of its resources to business loans as a commercial bank.

The federal government has been aware of problems at First National for awhile.

The Office of the Comptroller of the Currency, which regulates national banks, on Monday disclosed a June 24 page-enforcement letter against First National Bank of Arizona and an 18-page order against First National Bank of Nevada. The two banks, both of which were owned by Raymond Lamb's First National Bank Holding Co., were merged on June 30 into one bank.

The regulatory orders directed the banks to increase their capital, which the banks apparently were unable to do, and gave the banks detailed instructions for dealing with numerous management issues.

Contact reporter John G. Edwards at [email protected] or 702-383-0420.

On a separate thought.

How many of you would even consider using a company to rebuild a 8 foot by 8 foot block wall (permits and all) plus paint for less than the cost to patch a concrete driveway at 1600.00?
Without reducing the homeowners property value and ensure a sound structure per city codes. Using new blocks, concrete, etc. Patching it reduces its useful life and the strength.

AB3 (Arizona)
Posts: 44
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MaryA1 on 07/17/2008 4:28 AM
AB3,

I'm not quite sure what you are concerned about. Can you give a bit more info? Spending reserve money has nothing to do with the budget, in that the money doesn't come from the operating account, it comes from the reserve fund. Is the board wanting to use reserve fund monies for operating expenses? Or, does the board want to use reserve funds to make improvements that you don't think are justified? Are you the board treasurer?

Reserve fund monies are like your retirement account. If you spend it before you retire you have nothing. If you don't contribute to it each pay check you will not have enough money to retire on.

Plus most governing documents say you have to maintain adequate reserves and adopt the findings of a third party reserve study. If the reserve study is outdated then your not going to have adequate reserves when it comes time to replace an item that costs 100k or more because you didn't save enough because of outdated information.

If you spend it on non-reserve study items and are not emergency expenditures, your not going to have enough when it comes time to replace it either. And if you replace items years before they are due you will not have the funds to replace the current items.

The annual budget has an operating budget and a reserve budget for items scheduled to be replaced and includes the scheduled contributions for the year. The reserve study is a budget essentially for your reserve fund monies.

How do you get bod members to listen, reduce spending to prevent transfering reserve funds to cover the excessive spending, and stop spending money reserve fund money on normal operating and maintenance costs? I've tried showing how to accomplish the exact same thing but half the cost including a warranty. Plus it allowed for an additional service for free. But, it was rejected by the pres. and she refused to even look at it. The vendor is a nationally known vendor with insurance and everything. But, she refused to even look at it or let any of the bod look at it. Now due to the lies of one everyone thinks that I'm just trying to be difficult because I keep trying to express the need to reduce costs by using alternative methods (quality not skimping) and complying with governing documents. It is part of the treasurers job but they only see it as me trying to undermine thier plans. She will not even describe verbally what the goal or plans are, it just makes no sense. It is even taken personally. The last company that did not listen to my advice on spending went out of business 3 months after I left.

How can I get them to listen? I've tried ever approach I can think of even trying to make it seem like thier idea. I even found a source they used 5 years ago to obtain information but they will not even listen to it. In return they gossip about me behind my back and discredit me to other ownes. I keep hearing pick your battles. But saving money is the only battle there is and I never said it can't be done. It just has to be done in a diffrent way. Why is it ok when it is the associations money but not ok when it is their own? It done intentionally and it is obvious but why? I must not have gotten that memo or something.

Any advice.
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
Make MOTIONS at the next meeting:

That the Reserve Fund plan be updated (if it's from 2005, it's time now anyway)

That a Finance Committee be established to make a report to the Board on the HOA's financial picture. Be on this committee, but don't chair it.

That all expenditures go thru the Board for approval. (The way you talk, it seems that things are being purchased and contracts signed without Board approval or knowledge. How is that happening?)

These motions will be in the minutes. Even if they fail, they will be recorded and you will have shown that you tried.

Your Board will distribute an Annual Financial Report to the members. It should be interesting.

MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491
Posted:
First of all, I can see where the board might get the impression that you have some sort of hidden or secondary agenda. Your comments are all over the place and disorganized. I'm not sure if you're angry at your board or if you somehow link them to larger political issues, like the mortgage crisis.

As far as "how to get the to listen," well, obviously, if you've tried everything and they don't, then you can't.

In which case, Susan's advice is right on target. If they won't listen, at least get your position in the record. If you can't do that or they won't allow it, you may well just have to walk away if you don't feel you can get the board replaced and you don't have the time, money, or inclination to sue.

Also, I'm trying to figure out your "wall building" question.

Not knowing what the wall looks like, what it's for (retaining wall? decorative wall?) what's actually wrong with it (structural issues? cosmetic issues?), or what similar projects in your area cost, it's really hard to offer a conjecture on whether we would use a company to rebuild it for $1,600. Or are they simply patching it? I really can't tell.

Anyway, I realize you're frustrated and, to some extent, ranting against your HOA, but sometimes posters, like Mary, contribute to a dialog by offering clarity or expanding on a point or two. Not all comments and replies will contain "advice," though some feel that is the only time one should comment.

For example, the little snip below to her was a little bit melodramatic, especially since she actually did say the exact same thing you did. In her reply to Kirk to clarify what can and can't be done re: proxies in AZ: "Kirk, Sorry! No can do in AZ -- proxies are outlawed. The members have 2 choices: mail-in ballots or voting in person. Any of the "snowbirds" who may not be around at election time can mail their ballots in."

It may be difficult and it may get a tad expensive, but it appears that if you feel that strongly about it, then, that may well be the route you need to go.

Secondly, it was her opinion that she doubted a the bank purposely gave fraudulent loans, why would she need to Put Up Or Shut UP for that opinion? We are not your enemies here, though many of us often can and do over diverse comments or positions.

Quote:
Posted By AB3 on 08/23/2008 1:52 AM
MaryA,

Were you going to offer any advice or just try or just show us how wrong you are? Sorry, hun your only partially correct. You are right about AZ not allowing proxies. However, ANY OWNER can vote by absentee ballot and they count for establishing a quorum and on petitions to remove board members. AZ laws give detailed instructions on how to do it. If you don't get enough votes to remove them you can't try again. And orgainizations to help you do it.
Owners addresses are public record just like association financials when it is a non-profit orgainization. It can prove to be expensive when having to mail everyone a petition to sign and a ballot.

The FDIC stated that the CAI bank was closed because they could not show solvency due to fraudulent loans. Look it up OR provide PROOF to support your comments!


MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AB3 on 08/23/2008 1:52 AM
MaryA,

Were you going to offer any advice or just try or just show us how wrong you are? Sorry, hun your only partially correct. You are right about AZ not allowing proxies. However, ANY OWNER can vote by absentee ballot and they count for establishing a quorum and on petitions to remove board members. AZ laws give detailed instructions on how to do it. If you don't get enough votes to remove them you can't try again. And orgainizations to help you do it.
Owners addresses are public record just like association financials when it is a non-profit orgainization. It can prove to be expensive when having to mail everyone a petition to sign and a ballot.

The FDIC stated that the CAI bank was closed because they could not show solvency due to fraudulent loans. Look it up OR provide PROOF to support your comments!


AB,

Did you not see my response to Kirk?

"Sorry! No can do in AZ -- proxies are outlawed. The members have 2 choices: mail-in ballots or voting in person."

Or, perhaps you're not aware that an absentee ballot and a mail-in ballot are one and the same??? Sorry, but I don't understand your remark that a absentee ballot counts on a petition to remove board members. The petition must be signed by the individual homeowners. But the votes cast to remove a board member can be cast by an absentee ballot. And, you're wrong. You cannot try again if the removal fails. An election to remove a director can only take place ONCE during that director's term of office. I suggest you read ARS 33-1243 (condos) or 33-1813 planned communities.

I am aware that member have a right to inspect and copy the membership list. In fact, Title 10 has a statute which specifically addresses "member's list for meeting" - ARS 10-3720. Were you aware of that?

Regarding the CAI bank that closed, my comment was: "I doubt the CAI bank gave loans that they knew would be foreclosed." Their lending practices may have been questionable, but no where in the article you posted did it say they intentionally gave loans that they knew would be foreclosed as you alluded to in your previous message.
AB3 (Arizona)
Posts: 44
Posted:
I apologize Mary, you are correct proxies are outlawed but mail-ins are allowed.

I have motioned for a new reserve study to be done. However, I don't think that it will be completed. I'm keeping my fingers crossed but I don't want to be heart broke when they don't. If they do understand the importance of it then they don't make it known. I think they do know it, but ignore the importance because it can cause banks to not finance potential owners. Then they would have to acknowledge that maybe just maybe they didn't think things thru. Nobody is perfect and I understand that but they shouldn't believe that they are too big to admit when they are wrong. I do!

I would rather have someone point out my errors otherwise I can't learn. At the same time they themselves complained about previous board inaccurate statements and violations of the CCRs. However, they did nothing change it are doing it themselves, and refuse to evolve or consider new or diffrent ways of achieving the same goal. They keep doing it the same way they learned then complained about. Its kinda funny!

What are signs of being burned out? They have been on the board 5+ years. Are they just going thru the motions? If not then it must be me! But I have no agenda. Unless you count cya being an agenda. I thought that was a responsibility.

It would be easier to follow if I diagramed it out. It is a tangled web of deception and misrepresentations. Didn't mean to confuse.

Again Mary, I am sorry. You were correct in what you said. Hope you can find it in your heart to forgive me. To anyone else I may have offended I am sorry. Interesting how easy it is to become what your fighting against. Admitance is the first step to recovery, I understand.

Wall is 8ft by 8ft block wall not connected to any home. I have found permits where people were rebuilding small retaining walls 3 or 4 feet or so that just create a barrier. Those cost about 1500.00 to 2500.00. I did discover they haven't been getting or making sure that vendors are getting permits. Doesn't that go along with supervising vendors?
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
AB3,

No need to apologize! I know these laws, not to mention our gov. docs. can be very confusing. :-)

What's the story on the block wall? Is this a wall owned by the assn that was damaged and needs to be replaced? If so, then, yes, the HOA should only hire a licensed contractor. Even if the wall is being built by a homeowner the HOA can require that a licensed contractor be hired. Any contractor can be checked out with the Registrar of Contractors and the BBB. We do this any time we are having any type of work done on our home. It's good business practice!
AB3 (Arizona)
Posts: 44
Posted:
Thanks for understanding. Is there a way to send private messages on this site? I'd love to discuss it with you if you live where i think you do but not in a public forum. You also may check out the http://hoanewsnetwork.com. You as well as others need to be aware. Speaking the truth isn't the perferred method of communication for this BoD. Being friends means nothing in this community. If you are where I think you are. If not this all means nothing to you.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
AB3,

Please feel free to contact me at: [email protected]

I live in Glendale.

BTW, I haven't checked out "The Nut House" in quite awhile! I find it much too tedious to navigate.

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