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Subject: HOA's and Swim Teams

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RobS
(Virginia)

Posts:8

07/05/2008 8:21 PM
We are having a serious issue with our community swim team. I had a long chat with the president of the swim team tonight and came to the realization that we are essentially letting an outside group use our pool for free with no contract in place to protect ourselves or set expectations. It recently came to light that even though the swim team is running the pool for 3 hours before it opens to the community, they are not checking the chlorine levels, have no idea what to do if they are low or high, and are not checking the filter system to ensure it is flowing correctly. The feeling from the swim team is that even if they could learn how to run they pool, they are concerned about their liability if they damaged the equipment. They would prefer the closing manager from our pool company up the chlorine level before they leave, so it is high enough in the morning. Here are some high level questions: 1. Do any HOA's sign contracts with their swim team? 2. Do any swim teams normally deal with the chemicals and filter equipment? 3. Do any swim teams test the chlorine levels on an hourly basis? 4. Do any swim teams pay to have the pool management company staff a pool operator during practices? Thanks, Rob

GlenL
(Ohio)

Posts:1223

07/05/2008 8:43 PM
There have been posts in the past about swim teams taking over community pools; you can use the search feature on the topics page to find them. My question is why is your community letting outsiders in to use your pool? Besides the obvious liability issue do your CC&R's allow for something like this? Ours do not.

SusanW1
(Michigan)

Posts:1540

07/06/2008 1:06 PM
Forget that it's a swim team. You are allowing a non-member group to come in and use the pool for a certain amount of time (Free? or do they pay a fee?) In any case, the pool is yours - with or without them being in the water - and it is your reponsibility to make sure it is up to code at all times. I agree, don't let anyone monitor or treat your pool, since you are the owner and liable at all times. It really sounds like there is a little resentment on your part that they are using your pool and not taking "care" of it in any way. Perhaps if they had to pay for the time, in some way, it might justify a paid staff member being on duty when the team is there.

KirkW1
(Texas)

Posts:685

07/07/2008 7:44 PM
I would agree that it would be better to get some form of payment from the swim team over having them do any pool maintenance. The payment need not be cash, it could be that they do some litter pickup or other service. Now I know very little about pool care, but isn't once or twice a day enough for water quality checks? And is your filter not on a timer? I would think (and could be way off) that if there is some flow gage in the filter system a simple look at it to confirm the water is flowing and a call if it isn't should suffice for their involvement with the maintenance.

RandalR
(Tennessee)

Posts:82

07/09/2008 3:41 PM
My sympathy goes out to you on having to deal with a swim team. "Our" swim team continues to think they own our pool and less than a third of the kids actually live in our neighborhood! They continue to have both morning and evening practices which prevent us from selling any appreciable number of outside memberships to offset our operating expenses. We finally got permission from "them" to let the residents use more than one lane of pool during their evening practices. As to you questions. Our HOA does not have a contract with the swim team. Some of our Board tried to implement one a couple of years back but the swim team didn't want to do one so it never happened. I think we have major liability issues should something actually happen during a practice or meet! The Association is paying for their liability insurance. The swim team does nothing as far as maintaining our pool. They don't think it's their responsibility since they're being generous enough to compensate us $60 for each out of neighborhood swimmer. (That money gets to be applied towards them purchasing a family membership if they want one) Sixty dollars doesn't come anywhere close to actually compensating us for what they're costing us in additional maintenance and lost memberships. They actually held a large swim meet at the pool one year and the chlorine level was ZERO! So who would be liable for that when someone got sick? Swim team does not use any of our pool staff for practices or meets because they don't want to have to pay for them. The Association ends up picking up the costs for renting port-a-potties and auxiliary lighting under the pretense that those are sanitation and safety issues and the swim team shouldn't have to pay for that. If your pool doesn't have a swim team now, make sure no one comes up with the stupid idea of starting one. It's an endless money pit.

HaroldS
(Arizona)

Posts:904

07/09/2008 4:32 PM
Sooooooooo glad we don't have an HOA pool. Do do a search for swim teams and you'll find more than enough headaches a voluntary board doesn't need. It's sure nice of them to allow your other members to use their pool.

KirkW1
(Texas)

Posts:685

07/10/2008 9:30 AM
Randall, You need to elect BOD members with a backbone. They should send a letter notifying the swim team that they will need to secure a new place to practice before the 1st of August. What you have described is a breach of the BODs fiduciary responsibility. the common properties of the HOA are for the enjoyment and benefit of any and all members. If your association has decided to open up pool access to offset the expenses then you could consider renting the pool to the swim team. But it should in fact be rented to them if they have exclusive use of any portion of the pool. Further, the swim team contract should require that the team carry a minimum $1,000,000 policy and it should indemnify the HOA. Right now your HOA is open to a lawsuit not only from a member of the team who become injured, but from any and every member of the HOA.

EllenS1
(Florida)

Posts:321

07/10/2008 6:03 PM
Rob, Why is this even happening? The pool should be for the use of the members and their guests and nobody else. I had a home with a pool but that didn't mean any neighbor could come in and use it. If I lived in this HOA I would demand my rights be protected and that I purchased thinking I would have use of the pool at any time and not have to schedule my time at the pool because a swim team took it over for certain hours.

RobS
(Virginia)

Posts:8

07/15/2008 6:53 AM
Hi everyone, I really appreciate all your feedback. I worked with our pool management company to come up with some guidelines we will work into a contract for next season with the swim team. 1. The swim team will employee at least 3 life guards and 3 pool operators. (These will be the 3 coaches). 2. The swim team will monitor and record the chemical and filter flow levels every hour as required by the health department. 3. The swim team will learn how to operate the automatic chlorinator to raise the chemical levels if they are too low. 4. The swim team will inform the pool management company immediately if any mechanical issues arise. 5. The swim team will maintain a minimum of $3,00,000 in insurance. Hopefully these few requirements will help us set a better tone with the swim team. Unlike some of the people who responded to this message the swim team uses the pool before we open it to the public and we only close it three times during the Summer for afternoon meets. Thanks! -Rob

KirkW1
(Texas)

Posts:685

07/15/2008 9:19 AM
I would change the language regarding life guards and operators. As written, it could be argued that they would need six people. I would state is something like: Swim team is responsible for ensuring that three life guards are on duty and qualified pool operators (may be the same people if qualified in both functions). Along those lines make sure they know what to do if there is too much chlorine and set some limits beyond which they will not swim. Do not rely on common sense as some people will say, well the chlorine is high, but what damage will it really do? And all the kids end up with their eyes burning (or worse). ("Suck it up kid, when I was a child I walked 25 miles uphill in the snow to swim. And then I had to walk 30 miles uphill in the snow home (barefoot).")

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