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JohnA3 (California)
Posts: 3
Posted:
Can a home-owner ask the community association managment co, for all architectural applications and thier outcome in the last three years, is it legal, do they have to supply the home-owner with that information, if yes within what time frame should they supply it.
PaulM (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 1,347
Posted:
JohnA3: I don't believe you, as a resident, are 'entitled' to architectural applications, per se'. However, if you want to follow the procedure as outlined in your official docs for a 'review' of records (and, in this case,
architectural applications w/approvals/denials), that is different. As long as you comply with the process set up by the docs and/or Board, they must allow you a review.

I suggest you write a letter to the Board or Mgmt. Company with your request for review, and cite the process as outlined. Kindly advise that you 'await a response with a time and date for review at their convenience'.....
JosephW (Michigan)
Posts: 882
Posted:
Good article from a CA attorney re: records:

http://www.communityassociations.net/cacondoguru/archives/2006/03/records_inspect_1.html

Also, go to www.davis-stirling.com, select "main Index" then "R" (for Records), then Records. They have a number of good articles on the subject.

Joe

Joseph West
Official HOATalk.com Sponsor
Community Associations Network, LLC
www.CommunityAssociations.net

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DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671
Posted:

John,
Why do you want to see them. Are you expecting that someone has not applied? I think that a total review of the records would be somewhat off limits for you unless you have an objective or suspision of non compliance with something. If that is what you are looking into, and I as chair of the committee, I would welcome you to review but with restrictions. Just going in to be nosy would not be something that I would like to spend my time having you go over all applications with you.
JohnA3 (California)
Posts: 3
Posted:
Thank you for all the good advice, the reason for the question is I have done some back patio improvements which looks beautiful, the association mgr is asking me to apply for permission after all has been done. There are others that have upgraded in the community that is not acceptable (extending patios into the community property, having built in BBQ etc) I want to know if those people have been asked to apply for permission to do so, and what was the outcome.
RaymondC (Minnesota)
Posts: 64
Posted:
For what it is worth, if no one else has ever complied with the rules, and no one else has had to submit for review, you have been asked to, and the history is irrelevant. Each board is charged with enforcing the rules. The fact that prior boards or even this board has not yet done so, does not excuse anyone now, or in the future. Rules do not change or go away because boards are uneven in their enforcement.

There is then, no point or possible benefit to you, of your request for prior records, and you'd best be working to satisfy their requirements.

Keep in mind all boards are volunteers, and have limited time and resources. Few can be so lavish with either as to enforce all the rules all the time against everyone who thinks they should be the exception.
DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671
Posted:

Oh Oh!, here we go again. Boards and ARCs not doing their jobs and now it comes down to a show down over another person who has not followed the approval process and has gotten a violation notice about it.

John you are right in noticing that others had not followed the procedures from your documents BUT, that doesn't mean that you should not have. Try and get a meeting with the ARC and your BOD. Work this out and get an application from them, pay the application fee and settle this.

Then as soon as you are in compliance, start to get the Board and ARC to notice how none of them is doing their jobs as previos Boards have not been doing theirs. Our your other choice is to get into compliance and not worry about the others because they are over and done with and there is not much that can be done now.

JanP1 (Arizona)
Posts: 76
Posted:
When our ARC committee submits an approval or denial there is notice sent to the Board. When the approval requires a variance to the standard ARC guidelines, there is a variance that is available for public review. The ratification of the variance is held at a meeting and a part of the minutes.

Attached you will find a sample of ARC guidelines (Snyopsis was a larger file so it is not attached in its full form)

Below is the draft of two variance that were reviewed discussed by the Board and one was adopted.

Conditional approval of the plan with the following conditional variance:

1184 is a home with a unique lawn configuration and existing natural landscape buffers. We will approve one of the following two alternatives for the homeowner to pursue.

The homeowner is to find a storage unit which is no more than 6 to 8 inches higher than the wall in the location approved in the current submission, and so long as such structure is placed at least 15 feet from the lot perimeter wall closest to the sidewalk on Antoinette or closest neighbor and landscaping efforts are made to provide additional landscaping buffer to minimize the visibility of a structure from the street and cul-de-sac.

Or

Because of the unique lawn configuration and existing natural landscape buffer in the form of a mature tree which would provide a natural visual landscape buffer we will grant structure proposed not to exceed 7'9" to be placed in a location closer to the house in a location, not to obstruct the drainage in the yard and at least 20 feet from the lot perimeter wall closest to the sidewalk on Antoinette or closest neighbor and landscaping efforts are made to maintain existing mature landscape tree and provide if necessary additional landscaping buffer to minimize the visibility of a structure from the street and cul-de-sac.
📎 Attachments (2):
📎117374937971.doc(144 KB)
📝117374941054.doc(112 KB)
DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671
Posted:

Jan,
I read both of your attachments but what we really need to see are the Restrictive Covenants. I would hope that the ARC guidelines that you attached are the same as the covenants. Once a committee or Board starts with the vaiances, that is when they get in trouble because of the differences and ambiguity of opinions.
So basically you are not happy about others having been given permission to do improvements or the fact that other have not gotten permission and went ahead anyhow. It sounds like what you are unhappy about is that these improvements are not within the ARC guidelines. And yet they want you to apply for something that is within the guidelines. Humph!! sounds like you have a valid reason to be angry but in the end, you still should just get an application and ask to be approved. If then they give you a hassle, THEN get your fur up and give them a list of improvements that are against ARC guidelines.
JanP1 (Arizona)
Posts: 76
Posted:
Thank you Donna, my association does clearly follow the CC&Rs and uses the guidelines to clarify the CC&Rs. Our process, unlike others, started at the beginning of the community, with the ARC committee, as appointed per the governing documents, created the guidelines, then reviewed by the attorney, distributed to the homeowners, discussed and adopted at a meeting of the Board.

JOHN'S QUESTION IS :Can a home-owner ask the community association managment co, for all architectural applications and thier outcome in the last three years, is it legal, do they have to supply the home-owner with that information, if yes within what time frame should they supply it.

ANSWER: Most homeowner lot files contain information that may be considered confidential therefore no homeowner should have access to another homeowner's file. Additionally, it depends on the method of documentation each Board takes and requires the management company to maintain. (I know some managers who purge files after a period of time. My ARC approval was purged and my only defense was my personal copy of the approval. - So in some cases it is a question of the Board's published policy on record retention.) Next question, what is reasonable. If this is a personal request, it is not unreasonable, if the state laws do not require the retention of such information in a log, which is available to the public, to allow the management company to charge the party asking for the information a fair and reasonable cost. If the association wants the information, they should negotiate a fair and reasonable fee for the manager to research and provide the documentation.

I'm lucky, our community started out documenting.
DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671
Posted:

Jan,
So sorry as my comments were meant for John. I must have left out the "H"
I wrote the ARC guidelines for our Developement of 565 homes so I know what most of the guidelines mean. Sometimes it is hard for people who are new to the HOA system of living, to understand the concept of getting approvals and yours are written in pretty plain English. Good job on that and yes, early enforcement and documentation is the key to a smooth running of this important part of an association.

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