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Subject: Different covenants for different lots?
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CecilM
(Virginia)

Posts:4


11/23/2019 8:50 AM  
Hi there, does anyone know if covenants can be varied for different lots?
For example if several lots have existing improvements and others have a lessor upgrade, can covenants treat those lots differently (in the same subdivision) or even exclude them entirely?
Asking from a legal perspective! Let’s assume the HOA does everything right in the writing and implementing the covenants.

TL;DR can you write covenants for lots 1 through 300 and omit lots 64 through 78 (for good cause)?

Thanks!
MelissaP1
(Alabama)

Posts:8753


11/23/2019 8:55 AM  
Short answer no. CC&R's cover ALL the lots. You can't just pick and choose. Doesn't work that way. A HOA can work like a "nesting" doll in the larger HOA's. Which there is 1 "mothership" and mini-sub HOA's under them. Usually that happens when developer keeps developing more land after each development is finished around the original.

A HOA doesn't keep the prices the homes sell for the same despite size/amenities. They just make it more attractive to potential buyers to want to buy into the HOA.

Former HOA President
JohnC46
(South Carolina)

Posts:8867


11/23/2019 10:23 AM  
Cecil

I agree with Mel. It is possible, and common, to have a Master HOA that has sub-HOA's. Typically the sub-HOA's will have their own Covenants and their own BOD with their BOD President have a Directors seat on the Mother HOA's BOD.

I say easy to include them is some way but you probably cannot eliminate them.
GeorgeS21
(Florida)

Posts:1469


11/23/2019 11:58 AM  
Hmmm ... not so sure.

I have property in an neighborhood with four adjoining phases (189 houses - about a quarter in each phase) ... there are minor differences between the CCRs ... nothing significant in any way, but ... could there be?
CecilM
(Virginia)

Posts:4


11/23/2019 2:55 PM  
Thanks for the great feedback.
Regarding “nesting” HOAs, do you think an HOA with lesser restrictions could be nested within another?
We are trying to raise the stakes on some covenants (this is what the residence want) but some lots cannot be conformed do to their configuration and some common elements like frontage fences.
Any other feedback is greatly appreciated!
JohnC46
(South Carolina)

Posts:8867


11/24/2019 7:56 AM  
Cecil

Maybe you could just keep those lots in consideration that they may not be able to abide by certain standards/modifications and let it go at that.
MelissaP1
(Alabama)

Posts:8753


11/24/2019 8:30 AM  
So are you trying to ADD elements to your HOA? That means a different angle when you modify the CC&R's. Are you wanting to make it a requirement to have fences? That's not necessarily a good idea as fences causes multiple issues. Our HOA we approved fences but we never maintained them. However, if a fence was deemed dangerous then we could make the owner do repairs or take it down.

Be careful of what you wish for situation. I wouldn't necessarily add additional items. Would want more restrictions on maintaining what you already have.

Former HOA President
CecilM
(Virginia)

Posts:4


11/25/2019 5:04 AM  
We have existing covenants that are expiring and there is a desire to modify and increase the scope of the new CRs.
However there are some lots that do not have the amenities that would be covered with the new CRs, such as frontage fencing.
We also maintain our own roads, and there are subdivision lots which do not use neighborhood roads and therefore should be exempted from other CRs and fees.
We are looking for a way to exempt those lots from parts of the CRs or exempt them from the entire HOA if possible.

I wish I had known about the wealth of information available from this community when we started this process!! Thanks all
CecilM
(Virginia)

Posts:4


11/25/2019 5:07 AM  
PS MelissaP1
all properties in the neighborhood with frontage already have fencing put in at the time of development. Looking for new ways to make sure that they are maintained and uniform. Thanks!
GeorgeS21
(Florida)

Posts:1469


11/25/2019 6:54 AM  
Cecil,

Allowing CCRs to expire is usually fraught as it is difficult to re-establish them - unless the community is really tightly knit and in broad and solid agreement.

Have you considered simply extending the covenants (I think this is easy in Virginia?) - and, THEN, updating those CCRs?
BarbaraT1
(Texas)

Posts:245


11/26/2019 9:01 AM  
Posted By CecilM on 11/23/2019 8:50 AM
Hi there, does anyone know if covenants can be varied for different lots?
For example if several lots have existing improvements and others have a lessor upgrade, can covenants treat those lots differently (in the same subdivision) or even exclude them entirely?
Asking from a legal perspective! Let’s assume the HOA does everything right in the writing and implementing the covenants.

TL;DR can you write covenants for lots 1 through 300 and omit lots 64 through 78 (for good cause)?

Thanks!




Yes.

I have managed several properties with covenants that only applied to certain lots. Examples: One HOA had fencing requirements that varied whether you had a corner lot or backed up the greenbelt. I had another HOA that had some streets with alleys and some streets without - streets without alleys had to screen their trash cans. Another HOA had one section of zero lot line houses, the HOA did their landscaping and they paid a higher assessment as a result. Another HOA - some lots had backyards visible from the public street and they had restrictions on the kinds of structures allowed in their backyards. Another HOA had varying requirements for the number of trees and shrubs in a yard based on whether it was a corner lot and the size of the yard.
JohnC46
(South Carolina)

Posts:8867


11/26/2019 1:43 PM  
Good post by Barbara and made me think. My last HOA had fencing rules that varied depending on a homes location especially corner lots and those abutting any pond. Thus different rules for homes in the same HOA.
TimB4
(Virginia)

Posts:16550


11/28/2019 1:42 PM  
I once looked for a home in Winchester where the developer had different covenants for each block (they messed up on how they recorded them), however it was one Association.

Basically, to do this, the covenants would have to be amended via the procedures outlined within the document.
This is not an easy task, but it can be done.
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