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Subject: Doing business from home
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Author Messages
RaghuramA
(Texas)

Posts:21


03/01/2019 6:33 PM  
Does HOA has right or obligation to warn or give violation notice to residents if they do business from their garage like weekend snack sale / cooking etc ?


Thanks
RA
KerryL1
(California)

Posts:6418


03/01/2019 7:15 PM  
Do your governing documents like your Rules & Regs or your CC&Rs forbid those activities? What is the exact wording if they're prohibited?
RaghuramA
(Texas)

Posts:21


03/01/2019 7:19 PM  
CCRs are silent on this.. there is no wording in them regarding home businesses.

Thanks
RA
RaghuramA
(Texas)

Posts:21


03/01/2019 7:19 PM  
CCRs are silent on this.. there is no wording in them regarding home businesses.

Thanks
RA
GeorgeS21
(Florida)

Posts:1243


03/01/2019 7:21 PM  
You are cooking in your garage and selling food from there on the weekends?

I would think the first requirement would be health department approval ...

Specifics would be helpful.
RaghuramA
(Texas)

Posts:21


03/01/2019 7:24 PM  
Yes..only one day in the week, but it is not me. One of the residents.
I am the board member.

My question is can HOA restrict it, when CCRs do not specify any rules on this.
If they do not have City approval, that will be separate case with City or Health Dept, but will HOA be responsible for not preventing it or giving notices to them not to do so ?

Thanks
RA
LetA
(Nevada)

Posts:712


03/01/2019 8:48 PM  
Posted By RaghuramA on 03/01/2019 7:24 PM
Yes..only one day in the week, but it is not me. One of the residents.
I am the board member.

My question is can HOA restrict it, when CCRs do not specify any rules on this.
If they do not have City approval, that will be separate case with City or Health Dept, but will HOA be responsible for not preventing it or giving notices to them not to do so ?

Thanks
RA




Here's some thoughts to ponder, are clients coming to this location to purchase food? Or is the person a caterer, are they delivering the food to clients. Issues like these pop-up up in my HOA on occasion.
We have had a guy do auto mechanic work bringing junk and whatever cars into the community to work on them, people waiting for their cars to get worked on, we had a barber set up shop in their garage.
we even had a lady open up a daycare and was using community amenities for her daycare. These issues can lead to bigger issues. our CC&R'S clearly forbid home businesses. but the covenants are too bland
and are just a blanket statement. This isn't difficult to enforce, just a pain in the butt..Review your governing documents, issue warning letters and follow up, fine them and call them to a hearing if the issue persists.
RaghuramA
(Texas)

Posts:21


03/01/2019 9:00 PM  
It is still in the starting phase only.. right now the customers are fellow residents. No big queues etc.
I'm just afraid if something god forbidden happens and Police / City or similar authorities shouldnt blame HOA as we didnt object it and prevent it.

Thanks
RA
TimB4
(Virginia)

Posts:16382


03/02/2019 1:30 AM  
Posted By RaghuramA on 03/01/2019 9:00 PM
It is still in the starting phase only.. right now the customers are fellow residents. No big queues etc.
I'm just afraid if something god forbidden happens and Police / City or similar authorities shouldnt blame HOA as we didnt object it and prevent it.




Authorities will likely not blame the HOA.

Individuals might (as the HOA has bigger pockets then an individual).


My suggestions:

1) get an opinion from your attorney (as this will help protect the Association and board).
The question to ask would be: do our governing documents restrict home businesses, specifically food sales from a garage?

2) If truly concerned, contact the authorities (permitting office and/or health dept.) about the activity.


However, If it were me, i would seek a legal opinion.
GeorgeS21
(Florida)

Posts:1243


03/02/2019 5:43 AM  
I would do as Tim says, but in inverse order ... everyone has a stake in health department oversight of food prep, and when you have that basic county fact, then determine your legal options.

If I could shut it down via the county, I would simply do that.

Takes photos and videos!
MelissaP1
(Alabama)

Posts:8297


03/02/2019 6:19 AM  
This type of business isn't against the law nor the HOA's. The "Business at home" regards to professional type businesses. What is often referred to as "Putting a shingle up". Which means businesses like a doctor's office, dentist, or lawyer etc... One that attracts parking issues and advertisement. You can't just open up a daycare in your HOA home.

However, a business like selling Tupperware, being a day trader, yard sales, or cooking 1 time a week don't fall into this category. The difference being needing a license to operate.

Now in this case it is more of an issue with the health department rules. Even if you cook at home, you have to pass their inspection. We have a "Meals on Wheels" group locally. Which they are even subject to the Health inspector. Being at home and doing the same charity work cooking meals is subject to that. Even if I sold home made goods at a flea market, health inspectors are to inspect.

So it's not necessarily "Illegal" what this person is doing. It's just more along the lines of bad business practices. # 1 they may need a business license. Something need to discuss with your local license department on those rules. Discuss the issue with the health department if have those concerns.

These people can continue to have their business in my opinion if no one is complaining about it with parking/eye sore stuff. It's just they need to do it on the up and up with what it entails to run a business.

Former HOA President
RaghuramA
(Texas)

Posts:21


03/02/2019 7:43 AM  
Thanks for all your replies.
Appreciated

Regards
RA
RoyalP


Posts:0


03/02/2019 10:10 AM  
Posted By RaghuramA on 03/01/2019 7:24 PM
Yes..only one day in the week, but it is not me. One of the residents.
I am the board member.

My question is can HOA restrict it, when CCRs do not specify any rules on this.
If they do not have City approval, that will be separate case with City or Health Dept, but will HOA be responsible for not preventing it or giving notices to them not to do so ?

Thanks
RA




NO

and

NO
JohnC46
(South Carolina)

Posts:8434


03/02/2019 12:16 PM  
Rag

As of now he is cooking for a few neighbors like a neighborhood party.
GeorgeS21
(Florida)

Posts:1243


03/02/2019 5:50 PM  
I am in complete disagreement with Melissa.

The prohibition against businesses is far more broad than those she ha stated are covered. I would certainly believe car repairs in driveways and garages, cooking in garages, parking of lawn service equipment, sales of equipment, dance schools ... sheesh ... long list of businesses these prohibitions in CCRs are designed to protect AGAINST.

Please don’t get depressed - just lean in and fight this sort of thing - maintain your neighborhood!
JanetB2
(Colorado)

Posts:4168


03/03/2019 8:52 AM  
First check with your local government planning and ordinance departments to see if this type setup is legal and if any license is required by your local government. They also should know if any health department licensing is required and most likely may know if they are licensed or not.

I have found with HOA’s if you can take care of an issue utilizing outside sources, it generally causes less issues between neighbors or between neighbors and BOD. If there is nothing in your documents addressing home businesses ... then local government entities are the best alternative. Otherwise you need to get owners meeting quorum and votes to change your documents to give the HOA authority to address home based businesses. Keep in mind if your documents do not address, then the HOA cannot be held responsible. Your BOD only has authority to enforce what is written in the CCR’s or required by any of your HOA State statutes.
GenoS
(Florida)

Posts:3048


03/05/2019 2:57 AM  
Posted By GeorgeS21 on 03/02/2019 5:50 PM
I am in complete disagreement with Melissa.

Ditto. Par for the course.
CathyA3
(Ohio)

Posts:299


03/05/2019 5:01 AM  
This may apply more to condo associations than HOAs, but you also need to consider insurance. The association is likely to be insured as a residential area, not commercial. You don't want your insurer to deny a claim because it resulted from business activities. (Our association's attorney has seen it happen, and he's adamant about any business activity that brings the public onto the property.)
FredW5
(Florida)

Posts:111


03/08/2019 10:45 AM  
I don’t know about regulations regarding cooking in garages as a business.I do know from experience that anyone over65 can work from home .
GeorgeS21
(Florida)

Posts:1243


03/08/2019 11:24 AM  
OK, Fred, I'll bite ...

Can you attribute the statement?
FredW5
(Florida)

Posts:111


03/08/2019 12:29 PM  
I can tell you from personal experience that part of the Elderly Protection Laws allows for those over 65 to work from home. As far as cooking in a garage. I don't know. -
GenoS
(Florida)

Posts:3048


03/08/2019 3:43 PM  
Posted By FredW5 on 03/08/2019 12:29 PM
I can tell you from personal experience that part of the Elderly Protection Laws allows for those over 65 to work from home. As far as cooking in a garage. I don't know.

What laws would those be? I think you just made that up. There are all sorts of prohibitions in Florida counties against conduction an occupational business from home that apply to both HOA and non-HOA homes and they apply to all ages.
FredW5
(Florida)

Posts:111


03/08/2019 4:33 PM  
I am a composer,producer and my home studio and company were approved when I turned 65.
End of story.(And I still don’t know about cooking in a garage) 😄
GeorgeS21
(Florida)

Posts:1243


03/08/2019 4:36 PM  
Fred,

I’m with Geno on this ... can you attribute, please? Just paste a link to the law ... would be very helpful.

I’ve worked in large corporations - with many, many over 65 white collar professionals ...we received significant training in a broad variety of topics. I don’t recall anything like you suggest.
GenoS
(Florida)

Posts:3048


03/09/2019 10:38 AM  
Posted By FredW5 on 03/08/2019 4:33 PM
I am a composer,producer and my home studio and company were approved when I turned 65.
End of story.(And I still don’t know about cooking in a garage) 😄

Artists, composers, authors and composers are explicitly allowed home occupations in my county, and the HOA follows the county code where possible. What you've described wouldn't be an issue (unless you're in one of those 55+ communities that have weird rules).

Anyone who moved into my HOA and tried to run a barber shop out of his garage would face the HOA violation policy if he continued to violate our CC&Rs after a warning or two, senior citizen or not, because there is no law, such as you refuse to cite, that does what you claim.
FredW5
(Florida)

Posts:111


03/09/2019 11:41 AM  
Thanks for your input.
I repeat that yes, when I went to court regarding Previous HOA saying NO ONE can work from home, they lost the case, and the Judge advised that any elderly person over 65, or handicapped is allowed to work from home, except, as you mentioned, someone running a business which increased traffic, added to disturbing and increasing noise, and dangerous endeavors.
GeorgeS21
(Florida)

Posts:1243


03/09/2019 12:20 PM  
Fred,

What is the attribution for your statements?

To where and what law are you referring?
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