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JoanF (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
I'm a new member of a BOD in a new (open less than 9 months) urban condo building (237 units). We're very near a downtown bar and restaurant district. Within our building, we have a second floor terrace with barbecues and a separate common/recreation room with pool table and 65" plasma tv. We are trying to devise fair rules for use of these areas.

In similar situations, are residents allowed to reserve such areas for private use? Is a fee charged? Are there stated limits on numbers of people (other than the fire reg numbers)? Are there limits on how often an individual can reserve the space? We don't have onsite 24 hour security, but are considering requiring this for parties when the areas are reserved.

If anyone has suggestions on how to write a policy that allows residents to have assurance they can plan a party and how the space available while not overly restricting access by others AND protecting the property, I'd appreciate hearing! The more we discuss the issues, the less agreement is reached!

Thanks.

Joan
JoeW1 (New York)
Posts: 728
Posted:
JoanF - IMO you should definitely charge for the use to reserve for a private party. Compensation to the association members for their inability to use the facility is only fair. Don't make it prohibitive, just enough to generate some income for the HOA. In my HOA we also charge for a cleaning fee and $250.00 refundable security deposit. As for capacity, our fire marshal has a limit and we don't exceed it.
GloriaM (North Carolina)
Posts: 829
Posted:
Joan:

A contract (agreement) between the HOA and the Owner would need to be drawn up. You would need to have rules for reserving the room in place. Definately the HOA should charge for a deposit, rental fee and a cleaning fee. Only the deposit should be returned upon the room not being damaged etc.

A calendar for the reservations should be established to keep track of who's renting and when.
PaulM (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 1,347
Posted:
Joan: You may want to contact the HOA insurance agent to confirm that renting out this space will not conflict with any insurance liability.
You do not want the HOA responsible for any 'guest' having difficulty while attending a function held at the HOA rec room.
NancyD1 (Florida)
Posts: 447
Posted:
We have a contract. The homeowner reserves the room with a $250. damage deposit, $100. rental, $100. cleanup. They do get the $250 back if the room is not damaged. There is a sign posted the week before that the room will be closed on that night. We do have a video camera and it has helped in deciphering problems with the renters.
BradP (Kansas)
Posts: 2,640
Posted:
Joan:

Some great comments already, I will just add to them. Yes, if someone is reserving for a private party I think you need to charge them because they are basically taking away the right for all the other members to use the facility. I would establish a rental fee and I would even go as far as to say the rental should be paid in advance to prevent the issue of trying to collect money later on.

I would talk with your insurance company and would also enlist the help of your lawyer to draw up a standard contract that you can use with everyone. One thing I would insist on for people having a private function is for them to obtain their own liability policy and to name the association as additional insured on that policy and to give you a copy of it before hand. Policies like that for a one day rental are very cheap and easy to get and it gets the hoa's insurance out of the mix a little in case of an injury or something.
NancyD1 (Florida)
Posts: 447
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By BradP on 08/23/2007 11:42 AM
Joan:

Some great comments already, I will just add to them. Yes, if someone is reserving for a private party I think you need to charge them because they are basically taking away the right for all the other members to use the facility. I would establish a rental fee and I would even go as far as to say the rental should be paid in advance to prevent the issue of trying to collect money later on.

I would talk with your insurance company and would also enlist the help of your lawyer to draw up a standard contract that you can use with everyone. One thing I would insist on for people having a private function is for them to obtain their own liability policy and to name the association as additional insured on that policy and to give you a copy of it before hand. Policies like that for a one day rental are very cheap and easy to get and it gets the hoa's insurance out of the mix a little in case of an injury or something.

We also require liability insurance from the homeowner.
JoanF (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Great responses-- thank you! It's interesting that everyone recommends charging a fee (I agree with this), but everyone here that I've talked to-- residents or not-- has objected strongly to the idea of a fee, even a small one. Doesn't look like this will be easy to resolve!
Jadedone4 (Virginia)
Posts: 495
Posted:
Joan, you might want to explain to the residents that the "fee" covers the wear/tear on the clubhouse for things like clean-up, additional utilities (gas, electric, water, etc) and "fairly" addresses how one owner is using the clubhouse, "exclusively," versus everyone. Common elements are to be for the use of all owners, not just one - so when one owner wants to use (exclusively) then it is appropriate that they assume the costs.
RobertR1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 5,164
Posted:
Jadedone4,
As an owner I don't believe I could swallow that the "fee" covers the wear and tear etc. Not unless there is a special account that this money goes into. We have a Community room with kitchen, etc, a very nice newly decorated room, actually about 1100 sq. feet, that we allow owners to use for free. Anyone else using the room is charged a fee of $100.00. They would have to have a "sponsor" owner and that person is responsibile. We charge a clean up fee also.
Since our absentee owner population is so large the room remains underused, which means little upkeep. We also use the room for a hit and miss Owners social hour. We do our own clean up on this but again it is just a "conversation" hour with no food but drinks you can bring. At times well attended and some good things have came out of the meeting. Our board is undergoing a change and it is hoped that we will have a board member there most of the time. Nothing is restricted and all opinions welcomed. We try to keep away from personal agendas and keep the conversation about what is helpfful to the Rgime.
PatrickH (California)
Posts: 204
Posted:
Hi Joan,

Lots of good feedback here. Since you have a new association, you can always start with a set of rules and regulations regarding the community room and change them over time as things progress.

As you can see, most associations charge some type of rental fee plus a security deposit. My HOA charges a $ 50 rental fee and a refundable $ 250 security deposit for renting the clubhouse at our recreation center. The $ 50 fee goes towards paying the gas, water and electricity used during the party and towards the wear and tear. You might be surprised at how much electricity, air conditioning and water 50 people can use at a party!

In your situation, it sounds like this room is available for all the members to use on a regular basis. If you're going to allow people to reserve it and have exclusive access, then there should be some limits on how often it is rented, maybe a limit of one weekday and one weekend day per week. You might also consider limitng members to renting it just once a month since you have so many members in your HOA.

If you don't have any renting limits or fees, I could see someone reserving the room every Sunday from now through January just so he and his buddies could party and watch football on the big plasma tv each week.

Perhaps you can start by sending out a newsletter to the membership to get feedback. A lot of them may not want to have the room reserved on weekends because that's when they want to use it. Others may be concerned about where all the guest's cars will park. other people may have othr concerns that you haven't even thought of. By getting comments and feedback, you can have the first set of rules made to address these issues. As time goes by and you see what works and what doesn't, the rules can always be updated.

CharlesG1 (California)
Posts: 2
Posted:
Regarding the reservation and use of our clubhouse,our HOA requires that the members obtain their own liability insurance with them naming the association as additional insured, however this has become an increasingly hard task to require. Most of the members insurance companies have declined to issue a certificate naming the association as an additional insured due to them not wishing to insure " the entire HOA ".
The BOD has even tried to commit the HOA's insurance carrier to supplement additional insurance for the members event, at a reasonable cost. This has not been met with any success either. Our carrier contends that they can issue a special event rider, however the costs are unreasonable. So, if you have a name and number for cheap insurance, please pass it on.
JoanW1 (California)
Posts: 12
Posted:
Hi Joan: Our senior gated community has a large clubhouse and a smaller cabana that our Rules & Regulations allow to be rented by an owner; but has limitations on the type of event; i.e., no graduations or birthday parties for minors, and no rentals on major holidays. We also have a rental agreement that the owner must sign, that spells out the terms of the agreement. You have already gotten some very good suggestions, but one I did not see is "Security." If an event will have 50 or more attendees, we require hiring a security guard to be present during the entire event(Our onsite Manager selects the security co., & makes the arrangements). The cost is added to the rental fee.

JoanW

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