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Tuesday, January 16, 2018
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Subject: CAM accountability
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Author Messages
BellaM2
(Florida)

Posts:61


01/06/2018 9:39 AM  
Please give me your opinion about this: I am on a HOA Board, with a very deceitful CAM. Recently 2017 I requested to know how much the Assoc. has accumulated in our Capital Contribution Fund. We vote on a flat fee of $400. April 2016 at a Board Meeting, she told us our Attorney said it was all good to go ahead. Of course, nothing has been done by the CAM since that vote in April 2016. To cover herself she sent a bizarre email in Dec. 2017 that says forwarded from the HOA Attorney telling us why this might be risky to collect, and could be a problem to the HOA. I looked very closely at the content of the email, went into the message source because of its suspicious content. This was a cut and paste format with the initials of the Attorney typed, but clearly not the way the HOA Attorney would initial any of his emails. It did not include all the other info that said Attorney always included on all the prior emails he would send directly to the Board. What are your comments or thoughts about this?
The REAL question is can a CAM Cut and Paste parts of our documents to suit her needs because she did not follow thru with the request to start collecting Capital Contributions April 2016? The CAM did not email the Attorney a few weeks ago, the email is not professional presented the way our Attorney would have handled an email, the email is signed not the way the Attorney ever signed off on emails. She, the CAM is as corrupt as you can find. The rest of the Board can't see this but I certainly can. BELLAM2
CarolF
(Florida)

Posts:379


01/06/2018 10:49 AM  
Bella - was this a one time fee in addition to your usual yearly assessment? Did you, yourself, pay this fee? Did you and everyone else receive notice of payment due? I realize I'm not answering your question about the legality of the CAM's letter, but I'm trying to understand the background of this issue.
Does the treasurer have any answers?
TimB4
(Virginia)

Posts:15081


01/06/2018 11:47 AM  
The real question I would have is why is the Board going to an attorney through the CAM?

The Board needs to talk to an attorney (and not have a third party do it for them).
If the attorney works for the Association (and not the CAM), contact the attorney directly and ask for a copy of those communications.
KerryL1
(California)

Posts:4632


01/06/2018 12:58 PM  
I'm not answering your question other, Bella. But...what the heck is a "Capital Contribution Fund?"

I also ask Tim's question, and agree with his advice.
TimB4
(Virginia)

Posts:15081


01/06/2018 1:28 PM  
Capital Contribution Fund is basically the reserves.

TimB4
(Virginia)

Posts:15081


01/06/2018 1:38 PM  
Some Associations will charge a capital contribution fee every time a property is sold. This contribution is then deposited to the Reserves. In some States, such a fee is not allowed.

Here is some more info:

Subject: contribution to reserves when new home is purchased 2015 thread on this forum

Reserves as Capital Contributions 2012 article

Apples and Oranges: Avoiding the Forbidden Fruit by Understanding the Difference Between HOA “Disclosure Fees” and “Transfer Fees”

GenoS
(Florida)

Posts:1761


01/06/2018 2:28 PM  
Stop worrying about bogus emails you think may be forgeries. TALK TO THE ATTORNEY YOURSELVES and ask.
RichardP13
(California)

Posts:2202


01/07/2018 8:59 AM  
Posted By TimB4 on 01/06/2018 11:47 AM
The real question I would have is why is the Board going to an attorney through the CAM?

The Board needs to talk to an attorney (and not have a third party do it for them).
If the attorney works for the Association (and not the CAM), contact the attorney directly and ask for a copy of those communications.



As a MC I often speak with the association's attorney on their behalf and with the Board's permission. If they have no attorney, I may recommend one, but they finalize the selection. If it is by email, I will always copy the Board president and they can forward to the other board members. The email or email chain is always saved as part of their corporate records. Remember, we are listed as the corporation's agent to receive information from the outside world on behalf of the association.
TimB4
(Virginia)

Posts:15081


01/07/2018 7:04 PM  
My Association utilizes our attorney as the registered agent (to receive information from the outside world on behalf of the association).
BellaM2
(Florida)

Posts:61


01/09/2018 9:42 AM  
This Capital Contribution is only collected when a sale is made. The owner at the time of transfer of title give a flat fee back to the HOA.
BellaM2
(Florida)

Posts:61


01/09/2018 9:42 AM  
This Capital Contribution is only collected when a sale is made. The owner at the time of transfer of title give a flat fee back to the HOA.
BellaM2
(Florida)

Posts:61


01/09/2018 9:42 AM  
This Capital Contribution is only collected when a sale is made. The owner at the time of transfer of title give a flat fee back to the HOA.
BellaM2
(Florida)

Posts:61


01/09/2018 9:42 AM  
This Capital Contribution is only collected when a sale is made. The owner at the time of transfer of title give a flat fee back to the HOA.
BellaM2
(Florida)

Posts:61


01/09/2018 9:42 AM  
This Capital Contribution is only collected when a sale is made. The owner at the time of transfer of title give a flat fee back to the HOA.
BellaM2
(Florida)

Posts:61


01/09/2018 9:54 AM  
Okay, nobody gets it! Its legal in Florida to have a capital contribution, Its in the HOA documents written by the Builder, Its also legal in NY, because I lived there. The Attorney was consulted in 2016 to go ahead. The CAM did not do her job of following thru on collecting the $400. fee for more than a year or setting up the paperwork. She decided to create her own email as if it came from the Attorney to cover her butt. The other 4 BM's might be out to lunch, but I keep all my emails so I know the game she is playing. I just wanted to know how a Board would feel if they had a CAM so treacherous. Its all in the timing to catch a CROOK!!
BellaM2
(Florida)

Posts:61


01/09/2018 10:09 AM  
Dear Tim: Its totally legal in Fl. this has been done over 10 yrs in some communities. I could call the Attorney, but we have a protocall. I am a VP not the Pres. To speak to our Attorney he charges $500. per call. Therefore, get more issues and approval of the Pres to email him. Timing is the key for this!! Build up a profile of unprofessional behavior is the way I see it. Thanks,
MarkM19
(California)

Posts:50


01/09/2018 10:16 AM  
Bella,
Emails and time stamps don't lie. It is your fiduciary responsibility to bring this to a head. If she will do this then what would stop her from any other type of fraud or corruption?

I had an Ex Board President that was doing many illegal things when I was elected to my board. He had support from the majority of our board at the time and they would not except the facts I presented. I sent a letter to every HO and outlined in detail the corruption and guess what he was bet soundly in the next election. Yours is different and in the my opinion much easier. The CAM is not an Elected official and Property Management company should have other managers that can step in. If not replace the PM.

You may also want to share with your fellow board members the definition of Fiduciary duties.

Go get her.
Mark
BellaM2
(Florida)

Posts:61


01/10/2018 1:22 PM  
Mark: You bring Tears to my Eyes! Thank You, I sometimes think I am crazzzy!! Talk about corrupt Board Members, I am dealing with 2, plus this CAM. I just keep wondering where these people come from. These BMs are willing to settle for anything, they behave as if this CAM is irreplaceable, and believe me that's just a small fraction of what this CAM woman is doing and I am the only one calling her out on some of her deceitful, disgusting...words cannot express my emotions. Thanks again.
MarkM19
(California)

Posts:50


01/10/2018 1:59 PM  
Bella,
I feel for you and I can promise I know it is frustrating. It is important that you stand up and fight for the things that you believe. Make sure you are not making false claims if you decide to send a letter to the community. It costs less than a dollar a household to send a letter. No one wants corrupt board members or CAMs handling their HOA funds. I know it stinks having to spend your hard earned money to expose this injustice but trust me you will sleep better not letting this "Rent Space in Your Head"

If you don't want to go this far I would recommend you prepare it with all of the facts and a copy of the Definition of "Fiduciary Responsibilities". I would mail it to the other board members and the CAM and let them know that if the problem is not addressed by a date of your choosing every homeowner will have the same information mailed to them.

The CAM also needs to provide a List of all HOA owners if requested. I would get that first so that she doesn't suspect what you need it for until she get the letter you prepare.

I was on our board for 8 years before moving to Texas. It took less than a month for me to realize how bad things were being run but it took nearly 2 years to drain my own swamp. When I got on my board we only had $3908.00 in our operating account and they were borrowing 20K from reserves every month just to pay the bills. Our annual budget was just under a Million dollars a year. Today the HOA has over 2.3 Million in reserves and 280K in the operating account. It is worth the fight and you will be a hero to the people who don't pay attention to their HOA.

Good luck again.
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