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Subject: Paint color dispute.
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Author Messages
CaseyS3
(Georgia)

Posts:6


11/04/2017 7:40 AM  
Hey guys I am currently in dispute over my front door. The board denied my choice and then asked me to paint a section for review. I painted the whole door and currently waiting on their approval. In the meantime I visited with the property management company about the dispute and current ACR practices. If they deny my request I am going to appeal based on the legality of the board making the ACR decisions and not having a modification committee. The management company seemed pretty clueless as to my claims but I hit her with the following information. I summed it up in a two page document I emailed to her and the board.

The bylaws do not list ACR as a board members job
The covenants has a paragraph discussing ACR process and states jurisdiction rest with a modification committee.
They bylaws and covenants task the board with appointing architectural review committee.

I will admit my door is a brighter green, but there are currently white, dark blue, 2 brighter red doors in the hood. one of which was built with the bright red door.

There is no design standards currently filled in the courts, nor any resolutions adopting a design standard.

It seems the 2 board members don't like my color choice, But it seems the paperwork is not in order to pursue me

I don't believe it effects values anymore then the fence that's rotting around the retention pond.

What do you all think?
BillH10
(Texas)

Posts:150


11/04/2017 8:10 AM  
I think you need to find out if the Board has appointed itself the review committee before you take any other action or chat it up with anyone about your proposed course of action.

If your application for the color you wish to use is not approved, your next step would be to prepare an appeal to the committee if one were in place. Since there is not, your appeal would be filed with the Board which is where you would ultimately file an appeal if the non-existent committee did not grant a variance for your color.
MelissaP1
(Alabama)

Posts:6788


11/04/2017 8:12 AM  
MC's are usually NOT the rule maker or enforcer. The board is. If you don't have an ARC, then the HOA board is to take over those duties. Plus the HOA board overrides ARC decision if there is a dispute. So if your board is saying "No", then it's a NO.

BTW: They say you pick your door color to best represent your personality. However, in a HOA you pick it by APPROVED colors. You do more damage to yourself if you don't comply.

Former HOA President
KerryL1
(California)

Posts:4381


11/04/2017 8:49 AM  
Is your Board just two w members? That's unusual.
KerryL1
(California)

Posts:4381


11/04/2017 8:50 AM  
Is your Board just two w members? That's unusual.
CaseyS3
(Georgia)

Posts:6


11/04/2017 10:07 AM  
No board members is composed of 3 members. I know one didn't mind my color but majority rules
CaseyS3
(Georgia)

Posts:6


11/04/2017 10:15 AM  
Thanks for the reply's. our bylaws and covenants state:

The bylaws of *** under section D (page 9) states” The board shall establish a new construction committee and modifications committee for the purpose of establishing and maintaining appearance standards in the community as provided in the declaration.”

The Covenants (pg3) define the modification committee or "MC" as the committee established to advise the NCC and or review and approve all modifications, additions, or alterations made on or to an existing structure on lots as more specifically outlined in article xll hereof.

The covenants (pg 22) discuss the Modifications committee, its makeup, and duty. The modification committee shall consist of at least three but not more than five people all who shall be appointed by and shall serve at the discretion of the board of directors. Members of the MC do not need to be members. Until 100 percent of the community has been developed and conveyed to owners in the normal course of development and sale the MC will act in an advisory capacity to the NCC with the NCC approving all community modifications. Thereafter the MC shall have exclusive jurisdiction over modifications, additions, or alterations made on to existing structures on lots.


As you can see after reading the bylaws and covenants I don't see how the board can assume this role. They are being judge and jury.
DouglasM6
(Arizona)

Posts:438


11/04/2017 11:47 AM  
They are Judge and jury. That's how it works.
Is your "modifications committee" and your "ARC" one and the same?
GenoS
(Florida)

Posts:1631


11/04/2017 1:35 PM  
One could argue, based on the limited language supplied from the governing documents, that paint colors are not something under the MC's purview.

Also, if the MC was "established to advise the NCC" then the NCC doesn't have to accept the MC's recommendations. By the way, what's the NCC?

Does the community have written criteria and standards for paint colors?

Easiest answer: paint your door again using an approved color.
CaseyS3
(Georgia)

Posts:6


11/04/2017 2:12 PM  
NCC was the new construction committee. We are completely sold out now so we no longer have the NCC. According to my interpretation we should have the modification committee and board of directors.
CaseyS3
(Georgia)

Posts:6


11/04/2017 2:14 PM  
There is no standard paint colors. This is my argument. I chose a color, they denied it. When asked for what is approved they cant produce anything.
KerryL1
(California)

Posts:4381


11/04/2017 3:07 PM  
Based solely on what you've related to us, Casey, the Board cannot order you to paint your door any particular color as there is no Board approved mandated color "pallet" to choose from. Unless GA is very weak in protecting Owners' rights, I don't see why you must comply with the board's demands.

Some here seem to think that HOA boards can demand whatever they please and that is not true. Board must comply with and where to the HOA's governing document and any relevant municipal or state laws.

Are you also saying, then, that Owners can paint their homes any color they want? That there's no required pallet for painting homes either? And if there's no Committee nor written standards, why did you "apply" for the colar in the first place? I feel like I'm missing something here.
TimB4
(Virginia)

Posts:14860


11/04/2017 4:34 PM  
Posted By KerryL1 on 11/04/2017 3:07 PM

Based solely on what you've related to us, Casey, the Board cannot order you to paint your door any particular color as there is no Board approved mandated color "pallet" to choose from.




Sorry. I completely disagree with that.

Most covenants require association approval prior to exterior changes.
If prior approval wasn't granted, then the owner is in violation and the Board can enforce the covenants.
KerryL1
(California)

Posts:4381


11/04/2017 5:15 PM  
I noted, Tim, that my reply was based only on what Casey wrote. If her/his docs state what you think they do, then I agree with you. But only Casey can give us that info.
CaseyS3
(Georgia)

Posts:6


11/04/2017 7:31 PM  
The documents state that colors must be approved by the modification committee. This was my whole discussion and questions I asked. Does the board have the right to be the modification committee when the covenants and bylaws give this task to the modification committee and architectural control is not listed under the bylaws as a job for the directors.

Currently in my hood the board never appointed a modification committee even though they are tasked with it in the bylaws. When sending letters they are addressing them self as the modification committee when in fact they are the board members. I have challenged them based on my interpretation of the bylaws and covenants.




JanetB2
(Colorado)

Posts:3642


11/04/2017 9:08 PM  
Posted By TimB4 on 11/04/2017 4:34 PM
Posted By KerryL1 on 11/04/2017 3:07 PM

Based solely on what you've related to us, Casey, the Board cannot order you to paint your door any particular color as there is no Board approved mandated color "pallet" to choose from.


Sorry. I completely disagree with that.

Most covenants require association approval prior to exterior changes.
If prior approval wasn't granted, then the owner is in violation and the Board can enforce the covenants.


And I disagree with you Tim ... The ACC needs to have standards in place. The OP has stated there are other colors in place ... "there are currently white, dark blue, 2 brighter red doors in the hood. one of which was built with the bright red door." Potentially standards should state all doors shall be X colors or something such as "neutral pallet" and if there are ZERO colors noted ... what do you deny??? They asked the OP to paint so they can review ... but what standards are they using to deny??? A Judge would have a difficult time agreeing with an HOA stating ... "Just because I said so...". WHY ... because the owner has their rights also as long as they follow the documents ... which unfortunately state NOTHING regarding the issue.
TimB4
(Virginia)

Posts:14860


11/05/2017 1:15 AM  
Janet,

We will simply have to agree to disagree then.
MelissaP1
(Alabama)

Posts:6788


11/05/2017 5:35 AM  
Choosing your own color is going to hurt you and your ability to sell in the end. There is a reason HOA's want consistency in their colors or themes. HOA's are to keep the property ATTRACTIVE to potential buyers. (They do NOT keep home values). If you go rogue on a color, then you stick out like a sore thumb. Potential buyers notice this. A smart buyer may ask the HOA about the door. They may find out it's a violation and the HOA is fining for it. No new buyer wants to walk into that kind of situation. If they do, then it's to demand you change the paint color before they buy.

So ask yourself... Is this worth having my house stick out and battle or just comply so I can sell later?

Former HOA President
BillH10
(Texas)

Posts:150


11/05/2017 7:50 AM  
Casey, in simple terms yes, the Board can appoint itself. You do not say, and I have never seen, language which prohibits the Board, or members of the Board, from being appointed to a committee or committees. In your own words, the Board is to appoint members to one or more committees but apparently the language in your documents does not preclude members of the Board from being those appointed.

This not the best or most desirable situation of course. It is always better to have as much participation by members as possible. It may be the Board has been unable to find volunteers to accept appointments to one or more committees. Perhaps you should ask if that is the case and, if so, volunteer.

I think you would be better served by asking how you can file an appeal of a rejection of your desired color for your door. You should be granted an opportunity to present your case to the Board. Beforehand ask for copies of relevant documents--color pallets, guidelines, list of approved colors, lists of colors for which variances were granted, etc. Build your appeal on the basis of those facts and not on your perception of a Board apparently not following a process.

BillH10
(Texas)

Posts:150


11/05/2017 7:51 AM  
Casey, in simple terms yes, the Board can appoint itself. You do not say, and I have never seen, language which prohibits the Board, or members of the Board, from being appointed to a committee or committees. In your own words, the Board is to appoint members to one or more committees but apparently the language in your documents does not preclude members of the Board from being those appointed.

This not the best or most desirable situation of course. It is always better to have as much participation by members as possible. It may be the Board has been unable to find volunteers to accept appointments to one or more committees. Perhaps you should ask if that is the case and, if so, volunteer.

I think you would be better served by asking how you can file an appeal of a rejection of your desired color for your door. You should be granted an opportunity to present your case to the Board. Beforehand ask for copies of relevant documents--a color palette, guidelines, list of approved colors, lists of colors for which variances were granted, etc. Build your appeal on the basis of those facts and not on your perception of a Board apparently not following a process.

JohnC46
(South Carolina)

Posts:7010


11/05/2017 3:35 PM  
Committees serve at the discretion of the BOD. It is quite common and lawful that the BOD appoints itself as the Whatever Control Committee. Also most docs say the BOD is the final decision maker even if there are committees.
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