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Subject: Buried portable basketball hoop
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DebbieM9
(Arizona)

Posts:2


10/23/2013 8:35 AM  
Hello, I have a question about our bball hoop. Our community doesn't allow portable hoops in the front yard, so we buried ours in the front to convert it into permanent. Our CC&Rs state: "All basketball goals must be pole mounted and permanently installed. Poles must be painted the color of the house." That's all. If you look up the definition of portable, it says that you can easily move it, definition of permanent means it cannot be easily moved, and is intended to last for a long period of time.

I realize that when the rules were made they might have intended to write them so that portable ones couldn't be converted, or maybe they just didn't even think of that possibility. Since the rule does not say what kind of hoop or how it needs to be installed into the ground, our hoop is in compliance. legally, the wording is what matters--people are allowed to do things all the time that the rule-makers didn't intend, which is why rules/laws are amended all the time. Our hoa board is a group of 5 friends, all men, who want nothing to do with any of this. They've denied our appeal and last night I had a second hearing where it was like a courtroom drama, them all yelling at me and laughing and rolling their eyes. They said that either I just want to argue or I don't want to do the work of converting it to permanent the way THEY want me to--putting a sleeve on it. I told them it would be alot of work for us to tear it out and re-do it all, my husband has knee problems and is on crutches, and I have MS. Their reasoning is that because the CC&Rs say no portable hoops allowed in the front, then mine doesn't comply. BUT, they will allow a portable converted to permanent only if I do it their way (their way is nowhere required in the CC&Rs).

I kept reminding them that they can't base their decision on what they wish the rule would be or what they think it should be, it's not a matter of broad interpretation like "a neat a tidy yard", its clearly says that all we have to do is "permanently install it", which is what we've done. I also told them that we've consulted several attorneys (my husband and several friends are attorneys) who have all worked with hoa boards and they all said this is ridiculous and should never go to court because the hoa would likely lose. The board just started yelling at me in response to that that they're "not afraid of lawyers and there's nothing that I can ever say that will change their minds ever."

One more thing--our next door neighbor buried theirs and was approved by the previous board because those people in my opinion were obviously reasonable. I had one of those board members come to my second hearing to back me up and the current board scoffed at her as well. I reminded them that they are legally bound to the CC&Rs, and not the other way around. They then told me that they didn't care because it's their decision and there's nothing I can do.

We are ready to go to court because of how terribly handled it's been and abuse of power that's been shown (one board member has had his portable out in front for almost a year and he conveniently brought it inside 2 hours before the hearing so that he could say that he wasn't breaking any rules).

Andy advice on how you would think it would go? Do we have a strong enough case?

Thanks alot
SteveM9
(Massachusetts)

Posts:3263


10/23/2013 8:43 AM  
Good luck.

Personally, I would mail a letter to each homeowner letting them know what is going on and potential costs to the association that will come out of their pocket. Typically, people don't know a board member is behaving badly because they don't care about the HOA until it hits their wallet. It wont help your court case, but may help people to realize the board needs to go.
SteveM9
(Massachusetts)

Posts:3263


10/23/2013 8:46 AM  
To a misbehaving board, there is nothing worse than everyone knowing about it.
TimB4
(Virginia)

Posts:16379


10/23/2013 9:28 AM  
Debbie,

Did you seek permission prior to burying the portable unit or did you just bury it because you knew your neighbor did?


If you failed to get permission prior to the installation, you were at fault. If this is the case and had you contacted this forum prior to responding to your Board I would have advised that you approach the issue with some humility. Admitting that you understood that you failed to get prior approval and you apologize for that. Than ask that since there are similar installations in the development that you hope that they will reconsider your request. Sort of a more flies with honey type of approach.

Unfortunately, since you have already had your meeting with the Board and this option may no longer be available as, per your posting, it appears that your Board is now in a defensive posture and that makes it difficult to compromise.

DebbieM9
(Arizona)

Posts:2


10/23/2013 1:40 PM  
We DID receive approval prior to us burying it, in writing. Thanks for replying
JohnC46
(South Carolina)

Posts:8419


10/23/2013 1:44 PM  
Deb

While this does not help you it does show differences. One local HOA here will not allow permanent basketball hoops. They can only be portable and cannot be left up overnight.





GlenL
(Ohio)

Posts:5491


10/23/2013 2:23 PM  
Posted By DebbieM9 on 10/23/2013 1:40 PM
We DID receive approval prior to us burying it, in writing. Thanks for replying



You left that out of your original post. If you have that in hand then IMO the current Board is wasting time and money and since your defense should cost you nothing, let them sue. But I would as Steve suggests inform your fellow homeowners of what the BOD is doing. Do any of your local TV stations have a "trouble shooter"?

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
KevinK7
(Florida)

Posts:1342


10/23/2013 4:50 PM  
Sounds like you have a slam dunk. Sorry for the bad pun.
AnnH5
(Florida)

Posts:304


10/23/2013 4:51 PM  
If you have the approval letter (and it is something like an ARC approval and not a former Board member saying "it should be okay"), then sit back and relax. If the HOA's attorney has all of the facts, they will hopefully advise the Board that it is foolish to pursue it and explain to the Board what the likely outcome will be.
TimB4
(Virginia)

Posts:16379


10/23/2013 4:55 PM  
As others are saying, if it was approved, it was approved.

Simply provide them with a copy of the written approval.
DaveD3
(Michigan)

Posts:796


10/24/2013 4:27 AM  
Not to get off track here, but how does one bury a portable basketball net set-up? Every portable one I've seen has the big black plastic base. You dug a hole and buried the whole base? Seems like a strange way to do it, but once it's done, I see no issues or real difference between that and a "real" permanent unit.
BasketballsI
(Maryland)

Posts:1


10/13/2018 3:48 AM  
d
GeorgeS21
(Florida)

Posts:1243


10/13/2018 5:00 AM  
Hmmm ...

1. If you received approval to bury it (from the same BoD?) then it seems reasonable and approved bury it, except ...
2. If when you buried the base it wasn't complete, didn't get get landscaped well, has some part showing, didn't look "permanent," etc ... perhaps this is the issue?
DouglasK1
(Florida)

Posts:1416


10/13/2018 6:01 AM  
This is a 5 year old thread, many of the posters who were involved are long gone.

Escaped former treasurer and director of a self managed association.
GeorgeS21
(Florida)

Posts:1243


10/13/2018 1:10 PM  
Gah - how does this keep happening?
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