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Subject: Yard Art Violations

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RonaldW
(South Carolina)

Posts:900

03/19/2007 12:39 PM
[quote]Posted By ToddD on 03/19/2007 9:59 AM Hi me again - again thanks for all the input :-) Another Question: If this person did take down the iron scroll and instead placed it on his front porch, attached to the home by his door, would that still be considered yard art? Many homeowners have vases, furniture, sculptures, etc. on their porches. I agree with you all, I think it adds personality and value to the community. Nothing in our CC&Rs state porch issues, however, is the front porch consider part of the yard? Again, another "grey" issue. I am agreeable to letting it stand, but the other two board members are being "sticklers" and seem to have a bone to pick with this one particular homeowner. Thanks again. [/quote] I doubt the front porch could be considered part of the yard. There may be other restrictions in the CC&Rs concerning attaching it to the house (it could be considered a "modification" much as adding or changing the color of shutters). If the homeowner wants to be a "butthead", he could put it on the porch and lean it against the wall or put it on a stand. Is there a reason the person won't submit an application to the ACC? Perhaps the other board members are being "sticklers" because this homeowner is refusing to follow proceedures.

Ron SC

JohnC10
(Arizona)

Posts:106

03/19/2007 1:50 PM
If you can express your individuality and be in complaince that IMO would be the best option. Afterall, gaining permission is as short-lived as a board member's tenure. Once a new board or member comes into power and decides they don't like your yard art, whether you have approval or not they'll have you take it down and/or fine you. I've seen it happen dozens of times. One arc approves it the next resinds that approval. No need to live by a bunch of stranger's arbitrary whims.

RonaldW
(South Carolina)

Posts:900

03/19/2007 2:20 PM
[quote]Posted By JohnC10 on 03/19/2007 1:50 PM If you can express your individuality and be in complaince that IMO would be the best option. Afterall, gaining permission is as short-lived as a board member's tenure. Once a new board or member comes into power and decides they don't like your yard art, whether you have approval or not they'll have you take it down and/or fine you. I've seen it happen dozens of times. One arc approves it the next resinds that approval. No need to live by a bunch of stranger's arbitrary whims. [/quote] No, written permission is good forever. Can you imagine an ACC approving an addition to a residence and a following ACC demanding that it be removed?

Ron SC

JohnC10
(Arizona)

Posts:106

03/19/2007 2:52 PM
I suppose in a perfect world it is.

ToddD
(Washington)

Posts:12

03/20/2007 9:55 AM
No, the lot owner is not the problem. It's the Board. Board approved, but now the Board is trying to causes problems for this lot owner because they know the rules better than the Board and/or management company. Like I said before, I think it adds value, and the other two board members don't like being shown up and are causing problems. Nothing short of that. I was hopeing to find an alternative to the issue, rather than the Board letting out its frustrations. Obviously this is a new HOA, and the Board just does not have the experience or know how or energy to put into it. Frankly, I don't particular like their "dicktater" (spelled that way for a reason) attitude. I seem to be the only person of reason and knowledge, as they just like going in circles. Let's resolve the issue and not tortue our neighbors.

JoeW1
(New York)

Posts:728

03/20/2007 10:02 AM
[quote]Posted By ToddD on 03/19/2007 9:59 AM Another Question: If this person did take down the iron scroll and instead placed it on his front porch, attached to the home by his door, would that still be considered yard art? Many homeowners have vases, furniture, sculptures, etc. on their porches. I agree with you all, I think it adds personality and value to the community. Nothing in our CC&Rs state porch issues, however, is the front porch consider part of the yard? Again, another "grey" issue. Thanks again. [/quote] ToddD!!! C'mon the issue is not grey at all!!! :) The answer to your question is YES placing it on the front porch (if porch is uncovered) is considered yard art. Why? Because yard art includes but is not limited to sculptures, and other freestanding or attached works on the outside of buildings as defined by your CC&R. Per your CC&R's - Yard Art: No yard pieces or yard art, including but not limited to sculptures, statues, and other freestanding or attached works, whether for decoration or otherwise, more than 12 inches tall or 12 inches wide shall be permitted outside of the Buildings and within view from the street w/o prior written approval of the ACC.

JoeW1
(New York)

Posts:728

03/20/2007 10:15 AM
[quote]Posted By ToddD on 03/20/2007 9:55 AM No, the lot owner is not the problem. It's the Board. Board approved, but now the Board is trying to causes problems for this lot owner because they know the rules better than the Board and/or management company. Like I said before, I think it adds value, and the other two board members don't like being shown up and are causing problems. Nothing short of that. I was hopeing to find an alternative to the issue, rather than the Board letting out its frustrations. Obviously this is a new HOA, and the Board just does not have the experience or know how or energy to put into it. Frankly, I don't particular like their "dicktater" (spelled that way for a reason) attitude. I seem to be the only person of reason and knowledge, as they just like going in circles. Let's resolve the issue and not tortue our neighbors.[/quote] ToddD - Caveat Emptor. I know you want to be the nice guy and do what you feel is right. No doubt you are coming from a good place. However, IMO your cc&r is extremely well written. There is a parameter (12 x 12), there is a method for attempting to exceed the parameter by the owners filling out an application. If you are going to rubber stamp the modification, at the very least you MUST get the owners to submit a posthumous application and document what they have done just like everyone else is supposed to do. If owners are not willing to respect the application process, it may be an initial indicator they will not maintain their modification. However, not submitting an application is snubbing the process of which they chose to buy into. That is not acceptable.

RonaldW
(South Carolina)

Posts:900

03/21/2007 6:28 AM
[quote]Posted By JoeW1 on 03/20/2007 10:15 AM ToddD - Caveat Emptor. I know you want to be the nice guy and do what you feel is right. No doubt you are coming from a good place. However, IMO your cc&r is extremely well written. There is a parameter (12 x 12), there is a method for attempting to exceed the parameter by the owners filling out an application. If you are going to rubber stamp the modification, at the very least you MUST get the owners to submit a posthumous application and document what they have done just like everyone else is supposed to do. If owners are not willing to respect the application process, it may be an initial indicator they will not maintain their modification. However, not submitting an application is snubbing the process of which they chose to buy into. That is not acceptable. [/quote] ------------------------------------------------------------------ Exactly.

Ron SC

PaulM
(Pennsylvania)

Posts:1347

03/25/2007 5:12 AM
RonaldW: to answer your question, yes, been there. No telling the lengths a Board/Committee will go to just to achieve their personal agenda-- even legal expense to Commu--and lining the lawyers' pockets in the process. Life in a community is only as good or bad as those in power at any given time 'perceiving' the covenants as they choose to.

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