Recording Meetings

ThomasS14 (Texas)
Posts: 1

Posted:

A member made a video and audio recording of a meeting of the Associations Board without notice or requesting permission. In fact, the board did not discovered that the recording was made until after the meeting because the member held the camera in her lap. The Association is exempt from the provisions of the Opened Meetings Act of Texas. Was making this recording a criminal act? Can the Association or those members that were recorded take action against the person that made the recording? The recording has now been posted on You Tube in at least four different versions.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

Was there anything embarassing or improper caught on the tape? This would be a question for a lawyer to answer. The best result may be an injuction to bring the video down off the web. However, I don't know the laws in Texas well enough to say that recording a meeting is illegal or not. The definition of "Open meeting" may be open for debate as well. Usually meetings are "Open to ALL members" not necessarily to the Public. This may be the gray area this falls under.

There's maybe not alot your HOA can do about this except make a policy that video taping is allowed as long as it is KNOWN. Maybe even do a pre-empted strike and start recording them yourselves. Charge people for a copy. This way the people who want to record the meetings as some kind of passive/aggressive effort can be subject to the recording as well. It's funny how once they realize their side is video taped, how they may change their attitude a bit...Showing 2 sides to a story changest the story to the full picture...

Former HOA President

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,046

Posted:

Thomas,

As you know, you won't get any legal opinions from this site. However, you often get well researched opinions.

The media asks the question "can we tape?" all the time. Because of this simple question, a website was developed to assist the media in answering that question.

Per this website, the person was allowed to do what they did and, in my opinion, was not a criminal act because:

1) they were at the meeting and were a party to the communication
2) consent is not required for the taping of a non-electronic communication uttered by a person who does not have a reasonable expectation of privacy in that communication.

Although your Association meeting was not open to the general public, it was open to members, members families, their neighbors, perhaps tenants that came, etc. Therefore, there was no
If you use the link and go to the website, you will read that there may be civil remedy for disclosing intercepted communication. HOWEVER, this would not be applicable based on what you have posted. This is because TX law defines interception as [emphasis added]:

"Interception" means the aural acquisition of the contents of a communication through the use of an electronic, mechanical, or other device that is made without the consent of a party to the communication . . ."

Since the person making the recording was a party to the conversation there was no "interception" of the communication that was done at the meeting. Therefore, there is no civil action to be taken.

I understand your frustration. I understand your possible surprise of seeing something on you tube you were unaware of. However, based on what you posted and my research, the member was allowed to do what they did.

If you a member of the Board, you may want to adopt a resolution regarding the placement of cameras if used within meetings (remember you must comply with State laws). If your a member, you might want to ask the Board to adopt a resolution. I'm not sure you can ban them - but you may be able to say that they must be placed in the back of the room for all to see. Of course, this won't stop people from using cell phones.

Hope this helps,

Tim

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,046

Posted:

I'm re-posting this to correct the linking issues.

Thomas,

As you know, you won't get any legal opinions from this site. However, you often get well researched opinions.

The media asks the question "can we tape?" all the time. Because of this simple question, a website was developed to assist the media in answering that question.

Per this website, the person was allowed to do what they did and, in my opinion, was not a criminal act because:

1) they were at the meeting and were a party to the communication
2) consent is not required for the taping of a non-electronic communication uttered by a person who does not have a reasonable expectation of privacy in that communication.

Although your Association meeting was not open to the general public, it was open to members, members families, their neighbors, perhaps tenants that came, etc. Therefore, there was no expectation of privacy in any thing that was said in the meeting.

If you use the link and go to the website, you will read that there may be civil remedy for disclosing intercepted communication. HOWEVER, this would not be applicable based on what you have posted. This is because TX law defines interception as [emphasis added]:

"Interception" means the aural acquisition of the contents of a communication through the use of an electronic, mechanical, or other device that is made without the consent of a party to the communication . . ."

Since the person making the recording was a party to the conversation there was no "interception" of the communication that was done at the meeting. Therefore, there is no civil action to be taken.

I understand your frustration. I understand your possible surprise of seeing something on you tube you were unaware of. However, based on what you posted and my research, the member was allowed to do what they did.

If you a member of the Board, you may want to adopt a resolution regarding the placement of cameras if used within meetings (remember you must comply with State laws). If your a member, you might want to ask the Board to adopt a resolution. I'm not sure you can ban them - but you may be able to say that they must be placed in the back of the room for all to see. Of course, this won't stop people from using cell phones.

Hope this helps,

Tim

SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202

Posted:

Of course you could look at her INTENTION for recording the meeting - which was a board meeting of a private corporation. The public is not invited to board meetings, just members. And the meetings are open to them for observance, only. Unless called upon, the audience has no role in the meeting.

The recording used in a way that benefitted the membership or offered clarity (information to them) would be one thing, but to expose, mock or demean the board would be quite another.

She should have announced that she was going to record the meeting. The board would have had the right to vote on granting permission UNLESS it is written in any document that allows it.

(PS - I would argue that she was NOT a participant in the meeting, but rather in an observer role.)

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,046

Posted:

Susan,

You brought up a good point. The OP only said it was a video of the Board.

I interpreted this to mean it was a video taken at a general membership meeting.
You interpreted it as it was taken at a meeting of the Board.

I think we need some clarification from the original poster.

Either way, I agree with you that the member should have announced that they were recording the meeting.

MikeS1
Posts: 521

Posted:

Here's some good references on Texas Law. http://www.citmedialaw.org/legal-guide/texas-recording-law

Texas Wiretapping Law
Texas's wiretapping law is a "one-party consent" law. Texas makes it a crime to intercept or record any "wire, oral, or electronic communication" unless one party to the conversation consents. Texas Penal Code § 16.02. Therefore, if you operate in Texas, you may record a conversation or phone call if you are a party to the conversation or you get permission from one party to the conversation in advance. That said, if you intend to record conversations involving people located in more than one state, you should play it safe and get the consent of all parties.

The law does not cover oral communications when the speakers do not have an "expectation that such communication is not subject to interception under circumstances justifying such expectation." See Texas Crim. Proc. Code § 18.20. Therefore, you may be able to record in-person conversations occurring in a public place, such as a street or a restaurant, without consent.

In addition to subjecting you to criminal prosecution, violating the wiretapping law can expose you to a civil lawsuit for damages by an injured party. Texas Civ. Prac. & Rem. Code § 123.002.

Consult the Reporters Committee for Freedom of the Press's Can We Tape?: Texas for more information on Texas wiretapping law.

MikeS1
Posts: 521

Posted:

Here's some good references on Texas Law. http://www.citmedialaw.org/legal-guide/texas-recording-law

Texas Wiretapping Law
Texas's wiretapping law is a "one-party consent" law. Texas makes it a crime to intercept or record any "wire, oral, or electronic communication" unless one party to the conversation consents. Texas Penal Code § 16.02. Therefore, if you operate in Texas, you may record a conversation or phone call if you are a party to the conversation or you get permission from one party to the conversation in advance. That said, if you intend to record conversations involving people located in more than one state, you should play it safe and get the consent of all parties.

The law does not cover oral communications when the speakers do not have an "expectation that such communication is not subject to interception under circumstances justifying such expectation." See Texas Crim. Proc. Code § 18.20. Therefore, you may be able to record in-person conversations occurring in a public place, such as a street or a restaurant, without consent.

In addition to subjecting you to criminal prosecution, violating the wiretapping law can expose you to a civil lawsuit for damages by an injured party. Texas Civ. Prac. & Rem. Code § 123.002.

Consult the Reporters Committee for Freedom of the Press's Can We Tape?: Texas for more information on Texas wiretapping law.

MikeS1
Posts: 521

Posted:

Here's some good references on Texas Law. http://www.citmedialaw.org/legal-guide/texas-recording-law

Texas Wiretapping Law
Texas's wiretapping law is a "one-party consent" law. Texas makes it a crime to intercept or record any "wire, oral, or electronic communication" unless one party to the conversation consents. Texas Penal Code § 16.02. Therefore, if you operate in Texas, you may record a conversation or phone call if you are a party to the conversation or you get permission from one party to the conversation in advance. That said, if you intend to record conversations involving people located in more than one state, you should play it safe and get the consent of all parties.

The law does not cover oral communications when the speakers do not have an "expectation that such communication is not subject to interception under circumstances justifying such expectation." See Texas Crim. Proc. Code § 18.20. Therefore, you may be able to record in-person conversations occurring in a public place, such as a street or a restaurant, without consent.

In addition to subjecting you to criminal prosecution, violating the wiretapping law can expose you to a civil lawsuit for damages by an injured party. Texas Civ. Prac. & Rem. Code § 123.002.

Consult the Reporters Committee for Freedom of the Press's Can We Tape?: Texas for more information on Texas wiretapping law.

DoloresM2 (California)
Posts: 60

Posted:

As a homeowner and an owner of several rental properties in my community I have found that the opinions offered on this board mostly seem to offer excellent advice on the various interpretations of HOA laws, So I think my question in this particular post is one more of curiosity than the letter of the law.

Board meetings are discussions held by the people that we, the homeowners, choose to run our community. Their voluntary participation is greatly appreciated and in most communities including the one in which I live, they do a great job and we all benefit. That being said, what is the problem with taping a meeting that is of concern to all those who live in the community. I know that there are some subjects that should be discussed in private, and such matters can be dealt with in executive sessions. However, there should be no expectation of privacy for those conducting or attending regular board meetings.

I find it hard to understand what possible objection there could be about the airing a board meeting that is probably only of interest to the people who live in the community.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,046

Posted:

Delores,

Based on the original posters comments, the problem was that it was done without anyone's knowledge. Although, I believe that the Board in question would have complained even if it was known ahead of time that the taping was occurring.

Since I work in broadcasting, I know that many people do act differently when a camera is on them. Many people will actually think prior to speaking when it is known that they are being recorded.

Personally, I agree with you that it shouldn't be a big deal.

That said, I do see the potential for abuse with the main issue being that anyone can edit video on a home computer and easily make it appear that someone supports or opposes certain issues by taking things out of context. If the board didn't record the meeting then they have zero documentation (or what we refer to as an "alibi" file) for comparison to put things back into context. It's also possible that if the membership knows a meeting is being recorded, some might not show as they don't want to be on camera and then show up on you tube the following day. This might cause a quorum not to be met - preventing business from being conducted.

No matter how you look at it, technology has placed a camera (in the form of a cell phone) in just about everyone's hands. The computer makes it easy to edit this footage as the person wishes. The internet makes it possible to have the video become the next sensation overnight. This is something all Boards will have to deal with at some point in time. Therefore, it's best that an Association adopt a policy that is in compliance with their State laws.

Tim

SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202

Posted:

This recording was done without notice, permission or knowledge to those being recorded and then was distributed to the general public, not just to Members.

I can't see one good thing in all this.

MartinH2 (Florida)
Posts: 24

Posted:

According to the post, This was a public meeting.
Just like one is allowed to record events in public, this is the same thing.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,046

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SusanW1 on 12/28/2011 7:03 AM

I can't see one good thing in all this.

Well we are only hearing one side and that was in one post.

I'd be interested in learning why the individual thought they needed a video. Was the Board saying one thing and doing another? Were Board members acting civil or like a bunch of children? We don't really know the background to any of this. We were just told that the act happened, not why it happened.

Again, I agree that the video should have been done in the open.

Tim

BradP (Kansas)
Posts: 2,640

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DoloresM2 on 12/27/2011 11:44 PM
As a homeowner and an owner of several rental properties in my community I have found that the opinions offered on this board mostly seem to offer excellent advice on the various interpretations of HOA laws, So I think my question in this particular post is one more of curiosity than the letter of the law.

Board meetings are discussions held by the people that we, the homeowners, choose to run our community. Their voluntary participation is greatly appreciated and in most communities including the one in which I live, they do a great job and we all benefit. That being said, what is the problem with taping a meeting that is of concern to all those who live in the community. I know that there are some subjects that should be discussed in private, and such matters can be dealt with in executive sessions. However, there should be no expectation of privacy for those conducting or attending regular board meetings.

I find it hard to understand what possible objection there could be about the airing a board meeting that is probably only of interest to the people who live in the community.

Dolores, the issues I see are two fold...first permission wasn't asked. Not that it was needed in this case but common courtesy is to ask or inform that you are doing this. Second issue is they posted on Youtube where not only the community can see but anyone can see. That is not the proper forumn for that video. We once had a lady who was irate that her name and address was published in a neighborhood only directory because she had an ex who was evil and didn't know where they were.

Recording the meeting to me isn't an issue, how it was down and what was done with it are.