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JohnD36 (Texas)
Posts: 21
Posted:
Excuse the wordiness. I have four important questions.

I live in San Antonio Texas. My HOA has 12 communities of 1275 Houses total (No Condos). The HOA generates over $1 Million + in income per year of association.

Question 1: Our MC lady also serves at the Book-Keeper and generated the data presented to the HOA members recently at the annual meeting (< Legit?).

I have attended a few HOA meetings and I have my doubts about a few things, seems like many things are hush-hush and we will discuss that in the "Executive Meeting" Air Quotes. One meeting I heard of the street sweeper contract but on the HOA annual financial report there is no line item mention to there being a street sweeper contract. There are other instances that make me wonder but this is just one example. Another was a total gate replacement for a neighborhood with no mention on the annual report.

Questions>

2. Does the annual report need to list contracts in plain language or can they be generic lumped together?
3. Does my HOA require any type of periodic Financial Audit by a independent agency, and would the MC be obligated to provide that to me?

I know they have had a security audit, and I see on this Forum that financial reviews are not as detailed as financial audits.

4th Question: The 2 communities that are public pay the same dues as all other private gated members. I have lived here for 3 years. Do I have any legal recourse on getting prorated future dues or money back? See below The quote from their governing documents

.
Finally I live in one of the 2 non gated with public streets and the other 10 communities have gates (some multiple and private roads).

In their own Amendment 6 (Effective March 2008): Documents it states that. "Annual assessments and special assessments due the Association will be fixed at a uniform rate: provided however, all Annual assessments for residential units with manned guard entries, gated entries, private streets, and or other items of significant expense not common to all of the Residential Units shall be set at a level sufficiently in excess of the annual assessments for residential units without manned guard entries, gated entries, private streets and or other item of significant expense not common to all of the residential units to ensure the payment of such expends solely out of the funds collected from lots within such resident units. If the board determines that the operating cost for certain residential units are significantly less that the operating cost of other residential units of the project, the board may in its sole discretion reduce the rates of the annual assessment for the residential units with operating costs significantly less than the majority of the other residential units of the project. All annual assessments may be collected on a monthly or quarterly basis in lieu of annually. This decision may be made by the declarant until turnover occurs and there after may be made by a majority of the BOD

At a recent meeting our president of 10 years stated he was required to charge everyone a equal rate. I then had to bust his bubble and read the above directly out of their own document posted on their own website.

The statement in amendment 6 that worries me is "The board may in its sole discretion reduce the rates" I know the gate expense is significant. There is alot of expense that we do not incur as a public community, and a full audit would prove that, but if my MC generates and presents the figures it is like the Fox watching the chickens.

My 58 unit community generates over $65,000 (-13K for Trash service). I think by crunching their HOA annual numbers we over pay by half 50% for services we receive. The MC lady at the meeting said the gated communities are only spending additional money on grease for their gates and she thought that it was the gated communities cost about possibly 3% more only than the public communities.

I do have the annual HOA report I could send someone if they wanted to look at it.

Hopefully my president or MC lady is not trolling the forum. :o)

JohnD36 (Texas)
Posts: 21
Posted:
I am reviewing our By-Laws and it states the following:

Article 4 Board of directors

...

* To keep and maintain full and accurate books showing all of the receipts and expenses or disbursements and to permit examination there of at any reasonable time by each of the owners, and to cause to be prepared by a competent CPA an annual financial statement of the Association.

* To prepare and deliver annually to each owner a statement showing all receipts, expenses or disbursements since last statement.

Question: I know they replaced a entire entrance gate at a HOA.

On annual report listed as: Fence/Wall Rep and Maint: $3540.

There is no way that giant gate got replaced for $3500 bucks. In addition there at 10 gated communities. There is much more gate repair going on than $3500.

It all goes back to..my HOA is generating and feeding their data to me. Annual projected income this year $1,821,299.00 for the HOA according to their report.

JohnD36 (Texas)
Posts: 21
Posted:
TEX PR. CODE ANN. ยง 82.114 : Texas Statutes - Section 82.114: ASSOCIATION RECORDS

(c) The association shall, as a common expense, annually obtain an independent audit of the records. Copies of the audit must be made available to the unit owners. An audit required by this subsection shall be performed by a certified public accountant if required by the bylaws or a vote of the board of directors or a majority vote of the members of the association voting at a meeting of the association.

Now I am still confused a bit. This "Audit" is something different than the HOA report, right? Should these CPA audit results be much more detailed than the HOA annual report?
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I think your seeing the forrest for the trees or just looking for something. If you are ALL part of the SAME HOA then you are going to be charged the SAME amount unless there are written such conditions based on square footage, type, or other physical definition. Amenities such as pool, tennis courts, or gates don't usually change the amount of dues you pay based on the HOA owning them. The HOA is ONLY fundedy by it's members for it's members. So all costs the HOA incur would need to funded by all it's members equally.

As for not seeing the street sweeper contract and referencing the "Executive meeting" indicates to me your HOA doesn't have a street sweeping contract. They are considering hiring a street sweeping contractor maybe in the future. The meeting is probably amongst the board members so they can decide on bids or other options before presenting it to the whole in the open meeting. I wouldn't say that is unusual activity as I find that it's good to have your board members working together before presenting things to the whole membership. The whole membership is going to have a million questions and I find that a prepared board who have taken the time to answer the questions themselves makes a better situation. It's frustrating to hear "I don't know" "We are still discussing it" instead of "Yes we have discussed this matter and here are the options we would like to discuss with you..."

The many posters on here are "experts" in their own HOA's for various states and regions. Each state is different but the advice given can still give you the direction your looking for. Review some older posts that may address some of your questions. We have many older posts that can help. Welcome and feel free to ask questions and we will discuss the heck out of them eventually...LOL!

Former HOA President
JohnD36 (Texas)
Posts: 21
Posted:
No, I think my post was too long in after thought.

In our HOA Amendment 6 it states:

Annual assessments for residential units with manned guard entries, gated entries, private streets, and or other items of significant expense not common to all of the Residential Units shall be set at a level sufficiently in excess of the annual assessments for residential units without manned guard entries, gated entries, private streets and or other item of significant expense not common to all of the residential units to ensure the payment of such expends solely out of the funds collected from lots within such resident units.

Now "sufficiently in excess" is not a certain dollar amount and I am not for lobbying they raise the other 10 communities, but I pay the same.

I say if the HOA does not know their own rules/regulations and the president is standing up in front of a crowd of 60 persons stating the rates have to be the same then there are issues.

Thanks for you reply though.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,047
Posted:

John,

Let me see if I can offer some assistance.

Quote:
Posted By JohnD36 on 11/12/2011 5:51 AM

My HOA has 12 communities of 1275 Houses total (No Condos).

Do you have one Association for all 12 communities or does each community have their own Association and there is a parent/master Association over all of the others?

Also, is the Association under declarant (builder) control or has it been transferred to the membership?

Quote:
Posted By JohnD36 on 11/12/2011 5:51 AM

Question 1: Our MC lady also serves at the Book-Keeper and generated the data presented to the HOA members recently at the annual meeting (< Legit?).

This is typical. An Association's Board of Directors (BOD) will hire a Management Company (MC) or a Community Manager (CM) to assist them with the day to day tasks of running the Association. Depending on the contract, the services provided would include accounting services. If it does, part of the accounting services could include a status report to the BOD and/or the membership.

Quote:
Posted By JohnD36 on 11/12/2011 5:51 AM

Does the annual report need to list contracts in plain language or can they be generic lumped together?

My Association has done both. Prior to me serving on the Board, the report to the membership included our bookkeeper contract as part of the Administrative Expense line item. When I started serving, we separated the two because I believed it should be done that way.

Bottom line, it can be done either way. The choice is the Boards and/or the membership (by pressuring the board).

Quote:
Posted By JohnD36 on 11/12/2011 5:51 AM

Does my HOA require any type of periodic Financial Audit by a independent agency, and would the MC be obligated to provide that to me?

This would depend on your governing documents and TX law.
The code you cited in a later post, TX ยง 82.114 applies to condominiums and, per your posting, your Association doesn't contain condominiums. Therefore, that statute would not apply unless your governing documents said it did.

If your Association is incorporated within the State of TX, then TX corporate code would apply. BUSINESS ORGANIZATIONS CODE (Title 2). Chapter 20 for all corporations. Chapter 21 if they are for profit. Chapter 22 if they are a nonprofit. Most Associations are incorporated as nonprofits. However, check your governing documents to be sure (typically the Certificate of Formation or the Articles of Incorporation).

Here is a link to TX State Statutes

Quote:
Posted By JohnD36 on 11/12/2011 5:51 AM

Do I have any legal recourse on getting prorated future dues or money back?

Based on the wording you posted about Amendment 6, Possibly. However, you would need to consult a local attorney versed on contract and corporate law. Depending on the amount you are talking about, it may be more cost effective to become elected to the Board and make changes to correct the discrepancy you see.

Quote:
Posted By JohnD36 on 11/12/2011 5:51 AM

At a recent meeting our president of 10 years stated he was required to charge everyone a equal rate. I then had to bust his bubble and read the above directly out of their own document posted on their own website.

In the President's defense, he has been on the Board since before the amendment. Therefore he most likely forgot about it. This shows why it's important for Directors to keep reviewing the documents and (in my opinion) why no single individual should serve more than 3 or 4 years before taking a break and then, if they desire, return to the Board.

This also shows how an educated member or educated membership can correct these oversights.

Quote:
Posted By JohnD36 on 11/12/2011 5:51 AM

The statement in amendment 6 that worries me is "The board may in its sole discretion reduce the rates"

I wouldn't be too worried about that statement. It just gives the Board the authority to lower assessments if needed.

Assessments are typically determined in the following manner:

Sum together the following yearly expenses:
1) Operating Expenses - Contracts, administrative supplies, taxes, insurance, etc.
2) Reserve Amount - Based on a Reserve Study, this would be the amount required to be set aside every year to pay for future maintenance, expected repairs and replacement of capital components. Here is a link about Reserve Studies
3) Contingency Fund - an amount determined by circumstances to defray the difference between assessment payments and expenses, budget shortfalls, perhaps insurance deductibles, unexpected expenses, etc. (not all Associations have a contingency fund).

Then divide by the number of lots to establish the annual assessments.

Based on the language in the amendment you posted, if I was on your Board, I would perform a separate reserve study for each community that has private roads and set assessments accordingly.

Perhaps you could volunteer to head a committee to perform those studies.

Quote:
Posted By JohnD36 on 11/12/2011 5:51 AM

The MC lady at the meeting said the gated communities are only spending additional money on grease for their gates and she thought that it was the gated communities cost about possibly 3% more only than the public communities.

As I posted, sounds like new reserve studies should be performed. Another option would be to separate the communities into their own Associations. Of course, you would need to consult an attorney on how to properly do this.

Quote:
Posted By JohnD36 on 11/12/2011 5:51 AM

Hopefully my president or MC lady is not trolling the forum.

Hopefully they are. This way they would see the same advice by individuals not vested in the outcome which, if they were, could taint the advice given.

Quote:
Posted By JohnD36 on 11/12/2011 5:51 AM

Question: I know they replaced a entire entrance gate at a HOA.

On annual report listed as: Fence/Wall Rep and Maint: $3540.

There is no way that giant gate got replaced for $3500 bucks. In addition there at 10 gated communities. There is much more gate repair going on than $3500.

It all goes back to..my HOA is generating and feeding their data to me. Annual projected income this year $1,821,299.00 for the HOA according to their report.

The Annual report is just a summary.

Per TX 22.351 "A member of a corporation, on written demand stating the purpose of the demand, is entitled to examine and copy at the member's expense, in person or by agent, accountant, or attorney, at any reasonable time and for a proper purpose, the books and records of the corporation relevant to that purpose."

Send a request asking to inspect all expenses relating to the replacement of the gate and cite this code as your right to inspect them.

Quote:
Posted By JohnD36 on 11/12/2011 5:51 AM

This "Audit" is something different than the HOA report, right? Should these CPA audit results be much more detailed than the HOA annual report?

As I posted earlier, the statute you used to ask this question doesn't apply to your Association unless your governing document says it does. You may want to review your documents and see if there is any requirement that a review or audit is performed.

Your question about what is an audit is similar to this thread in HOAtalk.

Here is another thread that also discusses it.

As your reading those threads, it is best that you don't post on them and reactivate an old thread. This is because statutes change and what was applicable then might not be applicable now. Therefore, if you have a question, about an old post (more than a few months) it's best to start a new discussion.

I hope this helps,

Tim

JohnD36 (Texas)
Posts: 21
Posted:
Tim thanks. This does not sound like this is your first rodeo.

(You Ask)Do you have one Association for all 12 communities or does each community have their own Association and there is a parent/master Association over all of the others?

ANSWER: We, 12 communities, 2 public non gated, 10 gated and private roads belong to one association.

You Ask) Also, is the Association under declarant (builder) control or has it been transferred to the membership?

ANSWER: I am not sure about this. I do know that in my community the county has not accepted the streets from the developer yet though. The docs state that the declarant is XXX XXXX , LTD a limited Texas Partnership. I did not put the actual company name on this posting. Not sure if that was a no no or not.

------------------

I know the HOA is non-profit.

Let me dig around in the rules and see if I can clarify the points you still need
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,047
Posted:
If the developer is still building, you are likely under Declarant control or in a partial transition (allowing some members to be on the Board but the Declarant still has the voting power to do what they want).

If the Declarant still has control, there are many things they can do without membership input or vote and you might need to wait until the Association has been turned over to the membership to address the issues you raise.

Others more versed in TX law might have better advice for you.

As a reminder, no-one on this site is offering legal advice. For that you will need to seek out a local attorney.

As for my first rodeo, I think it still is. I only really became involved in my Association about 5 years ago when I had an issue with my Association. This site helped me a lot in dealing with that issue. The easiest, and typically quickest, way to correct issues is by becoming involved with the workings of the Association.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,047
Posted:
John,

I left off that Property Code, Title 11 would apply to you as well.
Title 11 addresses restrictive covenants.

BTW - on the cost of the gate. I was thinking that if the builder is still involved, the builder may have picked up some or all of the cost for the gate.

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