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RicaH (Florida)
Posts: 7
Posted:
Just curious if there are any thoughts or advice out there regarding sharing names and contact information for all of the residents in our neighborhood with one another. This was done in the past, but it has been over 10 years. We have a small neighborhood (only 25 homes), so it doesn't seem like a big deal, and could be a good thing if people have the means to get in touch with one another. Does anyone see any problems with this?
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,061
Posted:
Although the name of the owner of a property, the property address and possibly the owners address (if different) is public record, individuals must make an attempt to ask for it. You are proposing sharing personal information that, certainly might be available through normal channels, to those who have not asked for it.

That said, I think its a good idea. However, you should first request permission from each owner/resident if they want that information included in a community directory. If they say no, then leave that info out. If a lot of people say no, it might not be worth doing.

BradP (Kansas)
Posts: 2,640
Posted:
Rica:

I think a directory is a great advice but would offer this advice. Anything that is not accessible by simply opening the phone book you should seek and get permission. Example, we had a lady who flipped out on us when her name appeared in our directory. Her reason was she had an abusive ex and was scared that he would find her. Better to ask but definitely sharing is a good idea.
CarolF (Florida)
Posts: 435
Posted:
Information from a FL law blog re: new FL statutes about privacy
"Some of the more overlooked changes to the laws affecting condominium and homeowners’ associations that were enacted by the 2010 legislature were the new privacy rights given to members and employees of associations.
For condominium associations, the following information about unit owners in the possession of the association are not accessible to unit owners: “Medical records of unit owners, Social Security numbers, driver’s license numbers, credit card numbers, e-mail addresses, telephone numbers, emergency contact information, any addresses of a unit owner other than as provided to fulfill the association’s notice requirements, and other personal identifying information of any person, excluding the person’s name, unit designation, mailing address, and property address.”
Similarly, for homeowners’ associations, the following information about its members or parcel owners in the possession of the association are not accessible to unit owners: “Medical records of parcel owners or community residents, Social Security numbers, driver’s license numbers, credit card numbers, electronic mailing addresses, telephone numbers, emergency contact information, any addresses for a parcel owner other than as provided for association notice requirements, and other personal identifying information of any person, excluding the person’s name, parcel designation, mailing address, and property address.”
These new information accessibility exclusions are important to most associations because those who have regularly published to its members a directory of the members probably has information about the members in the directory that would now be considered private and not to be available to the other members. Examples would be northern addresses and phone numbers, and e-mail addresses.
Because the directories published in the past were allowed to contain such information as the information was not considered inaccessible to the members, that information is already “out there.”
However, when it comes time now to publish a new directory of the members, we suggest that you first send a notice or letter to all members asking them to let the association know if they don’t want any of the information contained in the last directory put in the new directory, or if they have any changes to their information for the new directory.
This way, they will have consented to the information being published in the directory that would now be considered inaccessible under the new laws. It would kind of hard for someone to challenge the distribution of information about them for which they have consented to."
LarryB13 (Arizona)
Posts: 4,099
Posted:
Be very careful as some people may not wish their information known even if it is already public.

A number of years ago I worked on a politcal campaign for city council. Someone brought in a directory from an elementary school in a rather posh neighborhood. The directory gave each student's name, address, and telephone number. It did not take a rocket scientist to figure out that little Molly Scmidlapp was Judge Schmidlapp's daughter and the phone number was the judge's unlisted home number. While this directory had been put together for the legitimate use of the teachers and staff of the school, the confidential information in it was going places that no one ever intended.
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767
Posted:
California has specific rules and restrcition as it relates to membership lists. I wouldn't be surprised if Florida didn't have similar langauge somewhere in Section 718 or 720.

Here is California rules:

Purpose for Request. The member requesting the list shall state the purpose for the request, which purpose shall be reasonably related to the requester's interest as a member. If the board reasonably believes that the information in the list will be used for another purpose, it may deny the member access to the list. If the request is denied, in any subsequent action brought by the member the association shall have the burden to prove that the member would have used the information for purposes unrelated to his or her interest as a member. Civil Code §1365.2(a)(1)(I).

Corporate Asset. A membership list is a corporate asset. Corp. Code §8338(a). Without the consent of the board a membership list may not be:
•Used to solicit money or property unless such money or property will be used solely to solicit the vote of the members in an election to be held by their corporation.

•Used for any purpose which the user does not reasonably and in good faith believe will benefit the corporation.

•Used for any commercial purpose or purpose in competition with the corporation.

•Sold to others

FredS7 (Arizona)
Posts: 927
Posted:
> Purpose for Request. The member requesting the list shall state the purpose for the request, which purpose shall be reasonably related to the requester's interest as a member.

Interesting language. So wanting the list for the purpose of organizing a party would, presumably, be a legitimate use that would entitle the member to receive the list.

> If the board reasonably believes that the information in the list will be used for another purpose, it may deny the member access to the list. If the request is denied, in any subsequent action brought by the member the association shall have the burden to prove that the member would have used the information for purposes unrelated to his or her interest as a member. Civil Code §1365.2(a)(1)(I).

That's a pretty substantial burden on the association. The association would need to defend its refusal if challenged. Faced with that language, the association would probably give up the membership list in almost all cases.

By the way, one VERY legitimate reason for having access to a membership list is to canvass the association in an election or other issues (removal of the board, for example).

(As I have noted before, in my association, in AZ, there IS a published membership list).
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,061
Posted:


Rica,

Did any of this discussion help you?
RicaH (Florida)
Posts: 7
Posted:
I very much appreciate all of the responses. It was especially helpful to read the comment on the Florida Statute and privacy. However, I have been unable to locate the actual statute that refers to this. It would be most helpful to have that, if anyone can assist. The only thing I can think is that it is more of a privacy statute in general that applies to organizations and corporations. Since the HOA is a corporation, the privacy rules would apply.

We plan to discuss this at our next board meeting in January. But, I will propose that we send out a communication describing our intentions of creating a directory that will be distributed only to homeowners in our neighborhood, and will give folks the opportunity to provide the information that they want to have included. If they do not want certain information provided, they can simply leave it out. Years ago (about 10), we had a directory which included children's names and pet's names, in addition to phone numbers. I would personally find this to be extremely useful, but can understand why some people might not want to have that information given to neighbors. So, we will simply give people the option, thus getting permission from anyone who provides it.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
The information is already out there. It's called a phone book. I think that is all the public access information you need on someone in a HOA if your NOT a board member. Some owner's don't live in their HOA homes and use them for rental property. Those owner's addresses are outside of the HOA property. It should ONLY be the addresses of the HOA property itself.

A HOA is actually lucky to even have a list of owner's names and addresses. However, that list should only be kept amongst the board members and NOT the general membership. The addresses and names are used for collection purposes which is a private matter between owner and board.

Am I against having a list of owners names and addresses availble? Not at all. It's a great idea especially for emergency purposes. Do I think it should be done? No. It crosses too many privacy issues. If I want to know my neighbor or fellow member, I know where they live already or see them at a meeting. Some people may feel that contact no matter the intention, is "harrassment". As many board members find out if they ever send a violation letter.

I think if you want to make this list then get a meeting together to discuss it. Allow the people to agree or disagree on the matter. It should be ONLY optional and with the information that owner may want to supply. I would even keep it as something upon request only. Our Home adreses and phone numbers are already public accessed. Making that information into a selective list makes it a bit more private.

Former HOA President
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,061
Posted:
Rica,

Here are some intersting links on the issue:

FL Constitution, Article 1, Section 23, Right to Privacy

Law Review paper titled THE RIGHT OF PRIVACY IN FLORIDA IN THE AGE OF TECHNOLOGY AND THE TWENTY-FIRST CENTURY: A NEED FOR PROTECTION FROM PRIVATE AND COMMERCIAL INTRUSION by two FL Supreme Court judges.

FL 718.111, item 12, Association Records which reads in part:

Notwithstanding this paragraph, the following records are not accessible to unit owners:
5. Social security numbers, driver’s license numbers, credit card numbers, e-mail addresses, telephone numbers, facsimile numbers, emergency contact information, addresses of a unit owner other than as provided to fulfill the association’s notice requirements, and other personal identifying information of any person, excluding the person’s name, unit designation, mailing address, property address, and any address, e-mail address, or facsimile number provided to the association to fulfill the association’s notice requirements. However, an owner may consent in writing to the disclosure of protected information described in this subparagraph. The association is not liable for the inadvertent disclosure of information that is protected under this subparagraph if the information is included in an official record of the association and is voluntarily provided by an owner and not requested by the association.

FL 720.303, item 5 (5) INSPECTION AND COPYING OF RECORDS which says, in part:

the following records are not accessible to members or parcel owners:
5. Social security numbers, driver’s license numbers, credit card numbers, electronic mailing addresses, telephone numbers, facsimile numbers, emergency contact information, any addresses for a parcel owner other than as provided for association notice requirements, and other personal identifying information of any person, excluding the person’s name, parcel designation, mailing address, and property address. However, an owner may consent in writing to the disclosure of protected information described in this subparagraph. The association is not liable for the disclosure of information that is protected under this subparagraph if the information is included in an official record of the association and is voluntarily provided by an owner and not requested by the association.
RichardW6 (Maine)
Posts: 13
Posted:
In Kansas, KSA 58-4608(5) requires that HOAs "establish a reasonable method for unit owners to communicate among themselves and with the board of directors concerning the association."

How we're to do that is fairly broad and ill-defined, so we elected to begin distributing an annual homeowner directory. Each homeowner was polled as to what information they wanted printed in the directory (phone numbers and email addresses), but as a minimum the homeowner's name and mailing address would be printed to meet this requirement. Out of 170 residences, two elected to have only their mailing address printed, but all others were very receptive to allowing all their contact information shown.

Had we printed and distributed the directory using all their contact information without first asking the homeowners, I'm certain there would have been many complaints. By asking first, I suspect homeowners felt more comfortable with releasing their information because it was their decision, not the board's.
RichardW6 (Maine)
Posts: 13
Posted:
In Kansas, KSA 58-4608(5) requires that HOAs "establish a reasonable method for unit owners to communicate among themselves and with the board of directors concerning the association."

How we're to do that is fairly broad and ill-defined, so we elected to begin distributing an annual homeowner directory. Each homeowner was polled as to what information they wanted printed in the directory (phone numbers and email addresses), but as a minimum the homeowner's name and mailing address would be printed to meet this requirement. Out of 170 residences, two elected to have only their mailing address printed, but all others were very receptive to allowing all their contact information shown.

Had we printed and distributed the directory using all their contact information without first asking the homeowners, I'm certain there would have been many complaints. By asking first, I suspect homeowners felt more comfortable with releasing their information because it was their decision, not the board's.
SS9 (Texas)
Posts: 4
Posted:
Back in the 80's we lived in a new development in Minnesota. I put together a neighborhood directory that included name, address, phone, employer, kids' names, pets, interests, etc. If you wanted a copy of the directory you had to be in the directory. Forms were sent out to be completed and returned. We updated it a few times before I moved. It was very useful, but I realize current privacy implications might make it less appealing to some.

I think taking the information from your database to produce a directory without permission from each homeowner would be intrusive. And if you do produce one, you really have no idea what is done with it after distribution. We live in a weird world.

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