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DouglasP
(California)

Posts:6

11/28/2006 5:27 PM
I am looking for an attorney who is very familiar with HOA laws such as the Davis-Stirling Act, SB 61 and CA civil codes pertaining to CID's. The Board has blatantly broken the new election law SB 61 by choosing the management company to act as the Elections Inspector even though I have sent the president of the Board the necessary 5% petition to have a special meeting of the homeowners to decide upon the Elections Inspector. This has not been done and the ballots were sent out last week to the homeowners and are stored in the clubhouse. I have the necessary paperwork written that proves that the Board has broken this new bill. The Board dropped the earthquake insurance during the August 2006 Board meeting without a quorum and without consulting the homeowners which was brought up in a heated annual meeting this month. The Board has not taken care of the widespread infestation of termites throughout the complex through preventative maintenance since the complex was originally built in 1972 which also conflicts with the Davis-Stirling Act. The Board along with the current management company (third within a year) fails to enforce the CC&R's and bylaws. The previous management company quit after just six months because the Board failed to enforce the governing documents and the new management company, goes along with the Board. The Board which has four members that have ruled for almost 20 years because of possible illegal vote counting. The Board also performs selective enforcement of governing documents and harasses homeowners like myself who speak out against their long term illegal and vicious conduct. I am desperately seeking a knowledgeable attorney who may want to take on this case either on contingency or possibly at a reduced rate. We have accumulated a substantial amount of evidence to take on a class action lawsuit in Superior court. We have 417 units in our complex which is located in Cupertino, CA

SuzyS
(Arizona)

Posts:10

09/06/2007 9:01 PM
If you received any assistance please let me know. We have a very similar problem here in AZ.

MelissaP1
(Alabama)

Posts:2207

09/07/2007 6:29 AM
I read your post and I think there are some areas you should do more research on yourself. There seems to be a good sized misunderstanding of what your HOA is responsible for and your MC. I am not sure you really understand the entire relationship of your role, the BOD's, and the MC's. Read a few more posts on here because you may be requiring more or putting more responsibility on an area that isn't responsible. The MC is a Hired sub-contractor to the HOA. It is not exactly responsible for enforcing the CC&R's/By-laws. Your BOD is. They just use the MC to write the notices or do some of the paperwork on their behalf if they choose and pay for that in the contract agreement. So to blame your MC for not enforcing the rules, isn't their responsibility. They just do what they are told by the BOD. As far as "harrassment", a letter of notification of a violation is NOT harassment. IF you left your garbage out on a Monday and the garbage gets picked up on Wednesday, they may send you a notice telling you that your not to do that. It's NOT harassment but their duty to respond to violations. How else are they to respond to a violation? I am sure you have requested violations notifications be done by the board. How do you think they do it? Telepathy? They do it in writing or in person. That's not harrassment unless they get personal and insult you without provocation. Which is fine line. I hesitate to hire an attorney unless you have a large group behind you. It takes a majority vote of the homeowner's to make changes. IT should also take that to hire an attorney to represent you. That's because (Let's all say it togetether) WHEN YOU SUE YOUR HOA YOUR SUING YOURSELF AND YOUR NEIGHBORS. It's better to have as many neighbors on your side when or if you sue so they agree to pay the increased dues or special assessment to cover the legal bills on BOTH sides. I think there is overall alot of confusion on your end on the responsibilities altogether. My HOA is NOT responsible for Pest control. It's usually an owner's responsibility. The earthquake insurance may be a homeowner responsibility as well. They may have dropped it to save money if it can be an individual's expense instead. Why carry more expenses on the group of owners than necessary to keep raising dues to cover.

Former HOA President

BradP
(Kansas)

Posts:2491

09/07/2007 6:35 AM
Posted By MelissaP1 on 09/07/2007 6:29 AM The MC is a Hired sub-contractor to the HOA. It is not exactly responsible for enforcing the CC&R's/By-laws. Your BOD is. They just use the MC to write the notices or do some of the paperwork on their behalf if they choose and pay for that in the contract agreement. So to blame your MC for not enforcing the rules, isn't their responsibility. They just do what they are told by the BOD. Melissa: Once again you are off base, the MC is an AGENT of the association, not a subcontractor, HUGE Difference. Depending on how the contract is structered most of the time the MC acts on behalf of the HOA and is responsible for enforcing covenants.

TracyT
(Maryland)

Posts:228

09/07/2007 7:37 AM
Douglas and Suzy, Check out the resource links from this site under Service Directory. Also, I recently saw a list of HOA attorneys (mediators) on one of my states (MD) government web sites under Alternate Dispute Resolution. The list included all attorneys who mediate, their firm, address, etc. and their specialty. There were actually a lot of HOA specialists. I suggest you try to get your boards to mediate (talk about the issues). This would be a much more cost effective solution than jumping right into a law suit. However, if they (your boards) will not come to the table then you've already made contact with an attorney who might be able help see your issues through. Good luck.

RogerB
(Colorado)

Posts:4686

09/07/2007 8:09 AM
Posted By BradP on 09/07/2007 6:35 AM Brad is absolutely correct. Apparently Melissa didn't read or else choses not accept the previous posts that have correct her on this

MicheleD
(Kentucky)

Posts:4491

09/07/2007 8:44 AM
Douglas's original post was in September of '06, and it appears that his last post was that post (he only has a total of 6). So, if I'm not mistaken, it is Suzy who is asking for assistance with a similar situation?? Suzy, if that is the case, could you please indicate exactly what your issues/concerns are? Thanks.

MaryB4
(Florida)

Posts:12

09/08/2007 11:18 AM
I disagree about hiring an attorney to represent you on issues you may have with your Board. That's a bunch of hog wash (when you sue, you sue yourself)....it's only purpose is to scare you (put fear in your heart) and prevent you from taking action. Another purpose is to keep the "Status Quo" and let the Board remain omnipotent. If the Board is not "above reproach"....nail them! I say consult an attorney....see how many neighbors will commit to financing.You might be able to settle through mediation (non-binding)so remember you can't get attorney fees back with mediation alone ...you must go furthur. It is expensive ($5-15,000) but if you win, fees can be part of the settlement. Warning: don't expect others joining you...maybe only a few..because most people sit back and just don't give a dam!

MaryB4
(Florida)

Posts:12

09/08/2007 11:19 AM
I disagree about hiring an attorney to represent you on issues you may have with your Board. That's a bunch of hog wash (when you sue, you sue yourself)....it's only purpose is to scare you (put fear in your heart) and prevent you from taking action. Another purpose is to keep the "Status Quo" and let the Board remain omnipotent. If the Board is not "above reproach"....nail them! I say consult an attorney....see how many neighbors will commit to financing.You might be able to settle through mediation (non-binding)so remember you can't get attorney fees back with mediation alone ...you must go furthur. It is expensive ($5-15,000) but if you win, fees can be part of the settlement. Warning: don't expect others joining you...maybe only a few..because most people sit back and just don't give a dam!

MelissaP1
(Alabama)

Posts:2207

09/08/2007 11:38 AM
The suing the HOA is suing yourself and your neighbors is NOT a scare tactic to frighten ANYONE away from hiring an attorney. Quite frankly, it's a reality check. It's advice so if you do decide to take action by hiring an attorney you should understand the situation your putting yourself in and others. I'd appreciate that advice being given to other members of the HOA so I atleast know that I am dealing with a member who realizes what risks they are NOT only taking on themselves but putting others through. There are other ways with dealing with your HOA than hiring an attorney and going to court. It may be as simple as having an attorney write a letter or gathering a majority vote of other homeowner's that disagree with a rule as well. The rules and regulations of a HOA are created by and for the homeowners. If a majority of homeowner's don't like the rules or the board, then they have the right to change or vote out the BOD. Every homeowner in "Good standing" has the right to vote. That vote is very important even if it is just one vote and not even a board vote. Keep in mind a HOA only needs an attorney really to represent them in court. So if a member decides to sue their HOA, the HOA is forced into hiring an attorney to represent them. That means the HOA's budget now has to pay for these legalities which comes from the homeowner's pockets. There's no choice in the matter the HOA has to have legal representation unless there is someone competent on the BOD to handle the matter and voted to represent them. It just starts a whole vicious legal cycle that doesn't end in a HOA when lawsuits get involved. The member gets an attorney forcing the HOA to get an attorney and it goes round and round and round. Later the HOA may feel they need an attorney "In-house" all the time which is an added cost. A member then is going to feel that is it is all right to sue their HOA or feels the HOA has something to hide because the HOA has an "In-house" attorney. So you never really get out of the lawsuit loop once it starts. A HOA is YOU and YOUR neighbors. That's who it is. There is no "They or Them" your fighting. It's the culture of your neighborhood and it's what majority wants that rules. If your in a minority group of opinion in your HOA it can be "awful". However, it's best to take a deep breath and realize what you really want as a result of your "HOA issues" instead of focusing on the problem. Without a solution in mind, your just chasing your tail and the tails of all your neighbors. Someone is going to get bit in the behind sooner or later.

Former HOA President

MaryB4
(Florida)

Posts:12

09/08/2007 11:56 AM
Former HOA President says it all. Once again I say consult an attorney and discuss your options. Mediation will be suggested as a start but in most cases you have to proceed further because of HOA Presidents who are adament about having their way and have a bad case of "Boarditis." Most are simp0ly volunteers and some how think because they are on a Board that somw how they are infused with superior intelligence. Most HOA DO have an "in house" atorney to advise these "amatuer" Board members on many issues because the Board members DO NOT KNOW EVERYTHING!

RobertR1
(South Carolina)

Posts:5164

09/08/2007 11:59 AM
As expected I will fall on the side of the gentleman asking for advise. It seems much more effecient to assume his complaints have some validity than it is to start blaming his actions. He is asking for advice about this situation, and I credit him with with having the interest of his neighbors at heart. However, all effort should be made, for the good of the neighborhood, to exaust all avenues of arbitration, plain old let's sit down and discuss this over a cup of coffe. Also keep in mind, you are in this for the long run, one little change at a time during an election or open meeting can help. Also, drum up some support and consider all opinions of your group.You sound like you are willing to exert considerable effort to right a wrong, as you see it, you community needs folks like that. Have you suggested that the Board appoint a committe or an outside company to oversee the elections. It sounds like your mind is made up but I agree it would be helpful to search this site and consider the posting about this problem. It can be handled by concerned and fair people, seek them out. Good luck!

MaryB4
(Florida)

Posts:12

09/08/2007 12:01 PM
Former HOA President says it all. Once again I say consult an attorney and discuss your options. Mediation will be suggested as a start but in most cases you have to proceed further because of HOA Presidents who are adamant about having their way and have a bad case of "Boarditis." Most are simp0ly volunteers and some how think because they are on a Board that somehow they are infused with superior intelligence. Most HOA DO have an "in house" attorney to advise these "amateur" Board members on many issues because the Board members DO NOT KNOW EVERYTHING! Do not sit back passively...that's what the Board is counting on...they know there is a serious case of apathy and they can pretty much do as they please!

RobertR1
(South Carolina)

Posts:5164

09/08/2007 12:06 PM
Damn, After all that I read Michele's post and find I have egg on my face again. Thank's for keeping us straight Michele, it seeems I remember something I said about a keen mind. Suzy, some of what I said may help, I hope so, andd keep us informed.

MelissaP1
(Alabama)

Posts:2207

09/08/2007 12:29 PM
Your right Mary, I just woke up one day and decided I want to be a board member and rule them all! Yes, you caught me and all the other board members in a HOA that we are up to no good and look out only for ourselves! Any member that gets in my way is just a pain and should be shot down for expressing themselves. That's way I always approached things. Never fair or listening. It's just the way to be on a HOA BOD. Gosh, your sooo perceptive! You know WHY the BOD gets their way??? It's because of OWNER APATHY!!! It's because the people who are ON their BOD are the Owner's who understand the importance of their home values and want to be involved in making sure they stay at or above value. The people on your HOA BOD are VOLUNTEERS who want to be there so they do have a say in their community. If the BOD is acting wrong, it's because of the majority of Apathetic homeowners who don't keep them in line. The one's that do complain, usually are the one's not getting their way. Wouldn't it be a Perfect world if we all got what we wanted? HOA's do NOT need attorneys to tell them how to do business. The business of the HOA is already in the documentation spelled out in black and white. I only consulted attorneys because I am NOT a practicioner of the law and have NO license to practice law. An attorney is hired to do just that, practice and know the law. If your HOA is depending on consulting lawyers and MC's it's because they are inexperienced volunteers who need help and should be directed to come here for advice or given a book. I don't expect a stay-at-home mother of 3 to even begin to comprehend how to run a HOA or corporation. That's beyond their scope or knowledge in most cases. Why hold people in BOD to a higher standard or expect professionalism from the lady/man next door? When your dealing with your HOA, your dealing with your neighobrs and not professional homeowner's with all the answers to all your questions. Guess what? Some of us that's been a on a board, need to look up the answers just like you did! It doesn't come naturally to run a HOA. Besides, you as a member are always ONE STEP from being a BOD member yourself. Try it sometime and see what criticisms you face on a daily basis for the SAME opinions you have now.

Former HOA President

MaryB4
(Florida)

Posts:12

09/08/2007 12:56 PM
Cut the crap....most HOA Boards are made up of people who have an agenda....NO ONE WITH ANY SENSE REALLY WANYS TO BE ON A BOARD, only those who are control freaks and people powerless in life individuals pursue being on the Board. It's truly rare and wonderful if you find altruistic and dedicated residents to be on the Board. In most cases this just does not happen! To be truly happy in an HOA, practice APATHY...I think you are very naive and must have been in a tiny HOA! Of course I'm speaking only of the BOARD I'm familiar with and I'm intensely involved in my HOA. Go to ABC.com and read the article about HOAs....48% are VERY UNHAPPY with their HOA!

MelissaP1
(Alabama)

Posts:2207

09/08/2007 3:17 PM
So Mary, do you want to be on the board? You'd better be careful of what you wish for because you might become one of us! The evil doers of HOA's with secret agenda's that somehow always get brought to light no matter how we try to do it underhandidly in an open meeting. I find it funny that someone will announce they are running for a board position and promise if they become a board member they will cut out corruption and put in a playground! Sound great! However, NOW when they become a board member getting rid of corruption and putting in a playground is now an "Agenda" plan they have to screw the HOA out of money. How dare they hire a HOA consultant with our money and put in a playground to have our kids fall down and sue us! To be a board member you must live and die on that double-edged sword! Who's to say if your ideas aren't your own personal "agenda" if you were to get elected today? Your complaint about your board members will be the SAME complaints members will have against you. Are you prepared to handle that on a daily basis? So I would criticize from the outside gently, calmly, and with a touch of reality. You know, I've been on BOTH sides of the fence in my HOA. I've been a board member, Vice-President, and President. I have also been just a plain old member who's dealing with a BAAAD BOD. Do I think a HOA BOD has an "agenda". I am sure they do. However, atleast the BOD has a direction and people willing to work on their agenda's. They don't just sit around from the outside and complain and do nothing but wallow in their own frustrations. Even if it's the wrong idea, atleast something is being done and I am not wallowing in everyone elses Drama. Drama doesn't make success, decisions good/bad do.

Former HOA President

MaryB4
(Florida)

Posts:12

09/08/2007 4:14 PM
Melissa, did you go to the ABC web site: http://www.kvue.com/news/top/stories/090607hoa-cb.aab3cd83.html It's about how many people resent their HOAs.....and that's for a reason! You missed my point.....I am intensely involved in my HOA....in my particular HOA there is secrecy and a total lack of information disseminated to the community. I, too have been on the inside and outside of this large association. The really qualified members of our community will not get involved because of the huge amount of time required to do the job properly, the pettiness, and lack of appreciation. I've seen over and over where the Board members take care of themselves first and their attitude is "every man for himself"....they are drawn to the Board to be able to get their own wishes fulfilled. In MANY years, there's only been a few that were committed to looking out for the whole community. I'm sorry but I'm telling it like it is.. ..that's the way it is in the majority of HOAs. Getting back to pursuing litigation....in many instances IT'S THE ONLY ANSWER.

RobertR1
(South Carolina)

Posts:5164

09/08/2007 6:13 PM
Mary, I read your story on that URL. The 57 million living in HOA in 2006 is certainly worthy of some contemplation. As shown, this number is on the increase. The Association are creatures of the developers, not the homeowners, and as such, it is amazzing we can function at all. We buy into the association that has a stacked deck. The Boards are willing, for the most part, to govern as if these laws that they live under have been handed down from the mount. In truth they are just a conglameration of a bunch of folks trying to legislate for their personal agenda. As time passes pressure will be put on the states to get rid of the developers manuscript to maximize profits and control (same thing). You can see the results of some states taking a revisit to what they have wroth. HOA should be taking hard looks at their documents and make a concerted effort to rewrite the legislation that keeps them from operating in a reasonable manner. So, I preceive that a lot of unhappines goes right through the board to the real culprit, the states blotched attempt to regulate something that is wway outside what they failed to see coming down the road. It will come as soon as enough people see the real problem with HOA living. Instead of being an isolated entity, the HOAs should be a force in the community. Dell Web in Sun City, Hilton Head comes to mind. As a community they have the numbers to effect most political elections in the country and they don't mind telling the pols.

MelissaP1
(Alabama)

Posts:2207

09/08/2007 11:29 PM
HOA's have always been a Developer's SALES tool. How else do you think they attract buyers? Offering amenities like pools, clubouses, and other features that otherwised owned INDIVIDUALLY would be unaffordable to most. It's much cheaper to own a "Common Pool" than to have one in your backyard. Plus the developer offers enticement by developing "Rules" so the owner's can "Control" their neighborhood and preserve values. Anyone on this forum or living in their HOA can NOT deny the above was a draw to them and a reason for purchasing. Developer's don't want to manage a HOA. They want to get their money and leave. The developer's money is made UPFRONT not in the maintenance of the HOA. So they draft the CC&R's/By-laws to slightly favor them and give them the Majority vote and control until time to turn it over. The developer does turn the development over to the owners and thus creates the HOA that is to run itself amongst the owners. However, many owner's neglect or don't understand the fact they are allowed or should modify the original rules to accommodate their needs. This rarely happens because of the disorganization of the transition. If you have problems with your HOA, you have to keep in mind you ARE the HOA. The HOA is designed to be a reflection of the owners. It just so happens that not many owner's want to be that active in their HOA. So the Majority of people who "Get it" do get in control of the HOA and control the other members. It's basically "Survival of the fittest". If you want to survive and have your way in your HOA, you have to be a part of it and part of the SOLUTION process. I don't think advising people to "Get a lawyer" EACH time they have an issue with their HOA is the best advice. You can't assume that the HOA BOD is Wrong. The BOD may be right and the person asking for advice could be in the wrong. If the member painted their house "Purple without asking for permission" and your advice to them is "Get a lawyer to fight your HOA BOD for not allowing Purple as a color" isn't the thing to do. I advice that you take every other action available like appeals or getting a significant majority to agree with your opinion. Quite frankly, I don't trust a lawyer. Especially the ones offering their services to you. You should be the one shopping and interviewing them. There are too many attorney's out there ready to jump on the HOA lawsuit bandwagon leaving the client and the HOA with little.

Former HOA President

MicheleD
(Kentucky)

Posts:4491

09/09/2007 11:18 AM
OMG. HOAs are not Developer Sales Tools. More often than not the developers have to create deed restrictions and a mechanism for enforcing them due to local city zoning and planning regulations on new growth and planned development. For many, they'd much rather just subdivide, sell to builders and move on. The majority of HOAs in OUR neck of the woods provide NO amenities at all. No pools. No clubhouses. No tennis courts. No gazebos. Condo associations may be different, but that's where you have to be very careful using that "broad brush." They DO provide a BLUEPRINT through the CC&Rs on what the appearance of the neighborhood should generally look like and how certain behaviors of individuals living there are to be dealt with in order to prevent neighborhood decline. I also disagree with Mary, however, regarding the altruistic board being the exception. Our community holds 2 conferences a year, sponsored by our local Metro government. In fact, we have a government department titled "Neighborhoods," whose primary mission is to assist neighborhoods and HOAs and their leaders in operating a well-run organization. They have seminars, symposiums, workshops, most free or with a nominal charge. Do you get cranky, controlling people on boards? Maybe was true years ago, but we don't find that to be the case anymore. People invest too much into their homes and the risk of losing it these days is apparently pretty high. Just take a look at what our local government is doing to assist those pathetic, controlling, no-life neighborhood leaders: http://www.louisvilleky.gov/Neighborhoods/ Looks like a pretty healthy and substantial resource that is HIGHLY utilized by neighborhood leaders of ALL types in our community, INCLUDING HOA BODs.

RobertR1
(South Carolina)

Posts:5164

09/09/2007 11:47 AM
Michele, Does my heart good to read your post and visit the url you sent. it's a matter of "building a better mose trap." IMHO your areaa is headed in a sensible direction to make use of all this talent in HOA's and I don't mean just the Board. I wish SC was so progressive and less stagnant because of their history of always staying behind the curve. SC is an absolutely beautiful placee to live. I wish there was more heeart to the place and not so much the need for profit, any kind. You do have some thoughtful topics in your post and I would like to see some of our regular members take a look at your URL and post some comments. Thank you.

MaryB4
(Florida)

Posts:12

09/09/2007 12:37 PM
pARAGRAPH #1 REPLY: We could well afford our own pool, outside membership for tennis (which we have @ another club)also pay dockage for our own boat (if we chose to have a boat) plus we like to select our own restaurants outside the developement instead of paying a set fee for meals @ the club. No..the ammenties were not the draw for us, we prefer to travel so we chose a community that was GATED for security with fewer ammenties that would be relatively inexpensive to subsidize for the other residents. I would like to point out that Melissa makes a lot of assumptions...have you heard the expression "only fools assume." Please try and remember this. Paragraph #2 REPLY: Our transition was well organized compared to some. We did our homework and found out how much we would need in reserves...hired an in-house attorney for guidance etc. P #3...spoken like a true Board member...those who do "Get It" get control of the HOA and control the other members...Precisely what I've said before. You only have to look @ your local and federal government to see what a governing body is good at: they look out for themselves first: best pay raises, best health care plan, best retirement. An HOA is just a microcoism of our federal government. P#4...Here you go again Melissa, making an assumption...No where did I say what to sue for...of course if you painted your house without approval of the ARB committee that would be in direct violation of rules/documents (our HOA has a committee to chose the color and that's it). But if yor BOD disregards the DOCUMENTS and flaunts their authority....operates in secrecy....does not keep the community informed...ignores residents.this is serious! Major being not following the documents....then you need to consult and shop for an attorney to advise you. These are serious issues coming from a negligent, incompetent Board. This is the first time this coommunity has pursued litigation in 19 yrs that I know of.....the rug they've been sweeping things under is now too small to cover their (Board) misdeeds. If you had cancer, would you just appeal to your doctor to change the diagnosis or would you get a second oppinion and find out what could be done to restore you to health again

MelissaP1
(Alabama)

Posts:2207

09/09/2007 1:35 PM
All have left to say on this matter is what if your mother was a board member of your HOA, would you feel the same about board members and BOD's? The fact is the people on your HOA board and in your membership are your neighbors. Treat them as such. When dealing with your BOD, treat them like you want them to treat you. You come to a meeting with a negative attitude calling everyone incompetent expect the same treatment of you from them. I would expect someone who doesn't like their board not knowing their board. If you had a good friend and neighbor on that board would appreciate someone calling them names and incompetent? I think not. BOD members are human too. We live where we work. And like any "dog", we don't crap where we live and we don't pick up yours either.

Former HOA President

JoeS9
(Florida)

Posts:1

09/09/2007 1:53 PM
I agree with Mary. I was treasurer on our Board, provided updates to the community on the finances and wrote articles in the newsletter on that and other areas of interest for the community. What I found was that the President ignored two legal interpretations of the insurance portion of our documents because it would cost him an assessment. After I was off the board, a board member did not run for re-election when his term expired, but rather continued on the board as an illegal member. Even after I pointed this out to him and the other board members until I forced the issue by having a board member take this situation to the Association lawyer. Once the lawyer ruled on this, the illegal member then "resigned", which was a laugh, since he was not legal in the first place. Many times you have no choice but to bring legal action against a board or board member in order to have them abide by the documents. I have found, like Mary that many people serve on the board for what they can get out of it, not for the betterment of the community. Many of those residing in the community do not get involved or seem to care about what is going on (much like with our government) and therefore, it is up to the few who want documents to be followed and watch what the board is doing that must take up the cause to keep them on the straight and narrow. Currently, we are pursuing litigation. After exhausting all other avenues, the board still wants to interpret the documents to their benefit at the detriment of the rest of the community. This has become an a cause in letting this and future boards know that this will not be tolerated any longer.

MaryB4
(Florida)

Posts:12

09/09/2007 2:09 PM
Poor Melissa, you just don't get it! I venture to say you were one of the incompetent Board members. That was a stupid analogy! I don't care if a Board member is my best friend (I wouldn't be friends with an idiot)....no excuses...anyone and I mean ANYONE should be held accountable for their actions especially when acting for a group of residents. You didn't remember about assuming sweetie...you don't know the problems, community, class of people..etc. that I have personally dealt with. When you have given "every benefit of a doubt" pretty soon you run out. Ask other HOA members....one bad apple can cause a multitude of problems....especially if the rest of the Board are the "go along to get along types"....sorta sounds like You.

RobertR1
(South Carolina)

Posts:5164

09/09/2007 3:28 PM
Can everyone agree that the advice they post is for the benefit of the folks that write in asking answers. We have no real way of identifing (ass u me is to make an ass of you and me, so they say, I don't think I believe that to be true all the time), who is right and who is wrong as far as the big picture is concerned. It would appear more members than BOD write for advice (observation, nothing more). And it can't be a game to see who can make the most posts without being wrong, I would win that. So, after a fashion, it should be about learning more about what we all consider an important issue. I would hate to see anyone leave the site here because they just couldn't stand someone else. Part of what we all preach around here is the value of give and take and negogiation. We should practice what we preach. The cream rises to the top.

RobertR1
(South Carolina)

Posts:5164

09/09/2007 3:30 PM
God Bless the Queen

MelissaP1
(Alabama)

Posts:2207

09/09/2007 3:52 PM
So I guess there will never be competent BOD members or HOA's? What a shame. Because, I thought that everyone should try to get along and work for the betterment of their community. However, if everyone the members elect are so incompetent and stupid, I guess that may be a reflection of what you have to choose from in your community. As for me, I choose to "Love thy neighbor" like the good book says, and let God doing the judging. I admit that I am not perfect and will let anyone know that in a heartbeat. I don't assume anything as anything can go. My advice has to have a direction so that later more relevant facts will come out. No one here knows the whole story about anyone or anything. We can only go from what we are told and what experience we may have had in that general area. Assumptions are what anyone makes of them. I am done with this argument. There's no way to ever get some people to see that BOD member or not, we are all neighbors and owners living together in a HOA who make mistakes and can learn from eachother. It doesn't make one more incompetent than another. It just makes us HUMAN.

Former HOA President

LisaS
(Illinois)

Posts:341

09/19/2007 8:25 AM
I have to agree...this forum is to provide assistance to those who need it, not wage personal battles against each other. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, right or wrong. This seems to me to be a lot of the reason why HOA members end up with attorneys. Respect. Some Board members are well intentioned and admit they don't know everything. They want to do better, and they research and learn. (many of them can be found here ;-) But some, the 'bad apples' , simply don't care if they are wrong. Many have agendas and their fellow directors adopt the 'go along to get along' philosophy. And consequently they drag the HOA into a court battle when they come up against those of us that don't like it and demand better. My two cents.

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