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TomS12
(Florida)
Posts:19
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| 05/16/2008 4:33 PM |
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Here in FL I recently had a discussion with a very knowledgeable person who's heavily involved in HOA advocacy, etc. at a state level. He was telling me that state statutes are basically useless if BODs simply choose to ignore the community members, especially if there is little community member involvement. Why? Because without strong community member involvement to quickly recall board members or the whole board through a petition process, the only alternative are lawyers. And everyone knows how expensive that can be.
So, without strong community membership involvement to pressure bad mgt, boards, etc, the state statutes are hardly worth the paper they're printed on. In other words, resolve issues as a community if at all possible, otherwise be prepared to pay.
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DonnaS
(Tennessee)
Posts:2853
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| 05/16/2008 5:29 PM |
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Well, ain't he a na- sayer. If everyone had his attitude, all HOAs in Florida would be in caos. The Statutes work because the Courts uphold them as the ruling entity. Lawyers and the Florida D.A. upholds them too. It's just the boneheads in Associations that don't believe in following the laws that wreck havoc on the system. Thank goodness they are in the minority.
If Boards refuse to enforce them, then it is up to the members to remove that Board, get someone in there who will follow and enforce the laws and get back to following what are fairly good guidelines to community living in Florida. It can be done and not all that difficult to do. |
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MaryN
(Virginia)
Posts:125
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| 05/17/2008 4:34 AM |
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Donna,
Would you consider moving to VA? Would love to have you in our HOA.
MaryN |
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DonnaS
(Tennessee)
Posts:2853
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| 05/17/2008 4:47 AM |
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Thanks Mary,
I just relocated to Tennessee and the State has virtually no HOA laws to follow. I have my work cut out here but if I ever straighten out these good ole boys, I'll give Virginia a wack. |
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TomS12
(Florida)
Posts:19
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| 05/17/2008 5:12 AM |
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Donna,
That's his whole point!!! Lawyers and the courts uphold the HOA statutes, NOT the community members. In other words, the HOA laws are ONLY enforceable through the use of LAWYERS...$$$. And you don't have to have a bunch of "good ol' boys" (are you from the NE?) with shotguns running the BOD either.
Case in point: A retired Marine and Florida community member, who was very patriotic, decided to go to his BOD to present his case for putting up a flag pole and American flag on his property. He was very polite about it and made his case very diplomatically to the board. They turned him down, for whatever reason. So, he approached them again, this time more forcefully, warning them that he would use a lawyer to challenge them if turned down again. Well, guess what the brilliant BOD did? Right. They turned him down. So, off to the courts it goes and guess who won? Riiiight! The retired Marine. Wanna know how much it cost the entire community? Just $350,000, that's all! THis was a much publicized case BTW, and you may even be familiar with it. Again, these weren't a bunch of hayseeds on the BOD, so THAT was the person I spoke with's point about statutes and the "non legal" effectiveness of them.
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DonnaS
(Tennessee)
Posts:2853
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| 05/17/2008 6:43 AM |
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Tom,
You must be referring to the Andres case from I think Jupiter or Boca. The Govenor, then Jeb Bush, stepped in and the flag flies beautifully in his yard.
The community members still are in charge of their own communities and if they fail to do so, then it ends up going the way of mediation and the courts. I have been lucky to be involved with 3 very strong and wonderful Boards, 2 in my rental places and 1 where I lived. Of the 3 and in almost 8 years, only one went to court and that was that Cadillac Escalade case where I live. 2 bone heads did not believe in what the Documents said and it took 3 years to straighten it out.
NO, I am originally from Wisconsin, then Florida for 7+ years and now in Chattanooga. |
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MaryA1
(Arizona)
Posts:2259
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| 05/17/2008 11:31 AM |
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Tom,
What your friend was referring to is the fact that most states do not have an agency that oversees HOAs. Because of this, the only way to settle a dispute is through the courts. This doesn't make the laws meaningless as the courts will look at the laws that are in place to make their decision. What is means is that too many boards have the attitude that they are above the law. They know that oftentimes they can get away with anything they choose to do because they know most people are not going to spend their life savings on a court battle. You cited a case that was won by the homeowner. I know of a case that was lost by a homeowner together with upwards to one million dollars of her money! Don't know how much the assn spent. |
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DonnaS
(Tennessee)
Posts:2853
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| 05/17/2008 11:40 AM |
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Tom,
I just reread your above post and the Association DID NOT spend $350,000. It was $35,000 anlong with Mr. Andres cost was over $36,000 |
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AnnaD2
(Florida)
Posts:338
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| 05/17/2008 3:32 PM |
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| Donna---come home....please |
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DonnaS
(Tennessee)
Posts:2853
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| 05/17/2008 4:12 PM |
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No can do, Mon Ami, but I do have duel "citizenship" so I can still keep tabs on ya'll down there in the swamps. |
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