What is next? > HOA Forum

Unanswered

Active Topics

Forums

Forums > Homeowner Association > HOA Discussions

Subject: What is next?

Prev Next

You are not authorized to post a reply.

Author

Messages

CharlesW1
(Georgia)

Posts:820

07/18/2006 9:39 PM
What is the procedure for a homeowner who receives multiply violation letters? Does it vary depending upon the city or state? There are homeowners that have received multiple violation letters for the same offense. I believe it continues to happen because nothing further is being done. Mean while the violators are making their, and my community look very unkempt ! I would appreciate any input . Thank you, Chuck W

Charles E. Wafer Jr.

RogerB
(Colorado)

Posts:3724

07/19/2006 6:47 AM
Charles, you need to ask that question to your Board. Does your HOA have Rules and Regulations on Enforcement of Covenants and Rules? If not they should create those and provide them to all owners prior to issuing violation notices. Some restrictions will depend on state statutes, as well as Federal Laws, and County/City Ordinances.

Roger Borcherding Official HOATalk.com Sponsor DARCO Property Management (Colorado) (303) 925-0150 *See legal notice below (end of page) or go to www.hoatalk.com/legal

CharlesW1
(Georgia)

Posts:820

07/19/2006 8:43 AM
Roger, appreciate your quick response. I’m going to look in my CC&Rs to read what the procedure would be. Thank you. I will look there first. Chuck W

Charles E. Wafer Jr.

SusieC
(Florida)

Posts:3

07/20/2006 7:25 AM
Your governing docs. should be clear about violations and the monetary penalty for them (i.e., 1st offence, warning; 2nd offence, $50 etc.). In Florida, per state statute, you must have a Grievance Committee set up in order to assess fines. The role of the Grievance Committee is to act as an independent body from the Board. The Grievance Commttee listens to the violating homeowner (should he/she request it) and decides if the Board is warranted in its assessment or not. Hope that helps.

CharlesW1
(Georgia)

Posts:820

07/20/2006 1:49 PM
SusieC, Thank you. I’ll look in my CC&Rs now! I appreciate the advice. It should help for sure. I find it very difficult to understand much of the CC&Rs. I have read it all just fine. I couldn’t tell what it meant though. Thanks for the info. Chuck W.

Charles E. Wafer Jr.

MargoV
(Florida)

Posts:1

07/20/2006 3:08 PM
What if your governing documents (By-laws and Covenants and Restrictions) DO NOT allow for fines for anything other than use of our Common Area and Facilities? NOTE: We have a Common Area, but no Facility, i.e., swimming pool, club house, etc. As we see it the only way we can assess fines is to change the Covenants and Restrictions and that, in our case, requires approval of 90% of the property owners. Margo V.

RogerB
(Colorado)

Posts:3724

07/20/2006 4:49 PM
Margo, I have never seen Covenants that narrowly restrict fines. If your's really do they need to be amended.

Roger Borcherding Official HOATalk.com Sponsor DARCO Property Management (Colorado) (303) 925-0150 *See legal notice below (end of page) or go to www.hoatalk.com/legal

JohnM3
(Florida)

Posts:208

07/20/2006 7:38 PM
Hey rog my docs require 90 percent to change. Lets see you get 90 percent of 305 families to agree on anything. Our docs were written by the developer in 1988

RogerB
(Colorado)

Posts:3724

07/20/2006 8:42 PM
Yes John it is impossible to get 90%. I am familiar with an HOA that tried and failed working constantly over a peroid of 3+ years. Now Colorado statutes require 2/3 which supercedes their Declaration and they finally were able to amend their Declaration.

Roger Borcherding Official HOATalk.com Sponsor DARCO Property Management (Colorado) (303) 925-0150 *See legal notice below (end of page) or go to www.hoatalk.com/legal

ValerieS
(Georgia)

Posts:19

07/21/2006 4:59 AM
I live in Georgia. Our Covenants provides a section on Compliance and Enforcement. There are also Exhibit items such as the ByLaws and the Initial Restrictions and Rules. The Board has the ability (community vote is not required) to ammend, modify, repeal, and/or limit these restrictions and rules. We chose to ammend. We (the Board) developed community Rules and Regulations. Therein we provided clear details (more specific than the Initial Restricitions) regarding items and actions not allowed within the community. Upon the advice of our attorney, we are not required to specify dollar amounts for violation offenses which provides us with the ability to fine according to the type of violation and the number of notices sent. For example, we will often provide residents with a written friendly reminder or two. If the resident is noncompliant, we will then have the management company send a violation notice and given a specific timeframe in which to respond and comply. If they remain noncompliant, a second violation notice is sent which indicates that corrective action must be taken within a certain timeframe. It also states that no further notices will be sent and fines will be assessed to their HOA account if corrective action has not been taken within that time. It is sometimes necessary for the HOA/Board to remove oil stains, repair items on the exterior of the property, etc. In such cases, the costs associated are charged back to the homeowner account. Our fines for violations vary and are assessed by the day or by incident (it can be $10 per day for improper storage of garbage cans; it can be $25 per day for repeatedly parking on the street or $25 for trespassing; it may be $50 each time that your dog is caught unleashed or $50 for riding an unlicensed motorized toy. If the fines are not paid, once an account reaches $300, it is forwarded to Legal and they are notified of our intent to file a lien on the property. If the account remains unpaid, the lien is filed and fines continue to accure. Sometimes it becomes necessary to file a lawsuit for enforcement. I would suggest the advice and assistance of your management company, if you have one. You may also chose to consult your HOA attorney's office. You have options. Your community should not suffer due to noncompliance of others. Good luck! ~ ValerieS

LeeS1

Posts:0

07/22/2006 9:43 PM
You might also want to check other possible resources--your Rules of Order or a Policy & Procedures Manual. I think the important thing is to not let any more grass grow with the matter. Action needs to be taken immediately, starting with due process, and then proceed up the ladder. If the violators thumb their noses at the letters, they are doing it because they know they can get away with it. That has to stop. Courts take into consideration the amount of time that has lapse. We had the same problem with a HO who said his pockets were deeper than ours (actually, he was right on that point)-- his message was, "Go ahead, sue me." (Be careful what you wish for, would have been my message to the guy.) He refused to remove a trailer on his property (of the RV sort). Unfortunately, it took 7 years by the time it got to court, and he lost--big time. We spent $30K in legal fees with this defiant person, but I am sure he spent a lot more. Actually, our HOA has never lost a case that has gone to court, and we have had our share of them. With my urging, board members are keeping much better documentation (objective, and following the rules), and the office staff has established a log so that every action involved with such a matter is recorded. In short, we did our homework, had our ducks all in a line, and that proved to be very good for the judge. He even commented on how well and objectively the association had managed this case, bending over backwards to get the violator to comply.

RogerB
(Colorado)

Posts:3724

07/23/2006 8:33 AM
Lee, your comments on Rules of Order or a Policy & rocedures Manual, notification letters, bending over backwards to try to get compliance, prompt actions, and good documentation illustrate why your HOA you have never lost a case. These procedures should be followed by every HOA. One question that comes to mind is why do you have your share of cases? Does more information need to be provided to owners in advance? By educating all owners periodically on restrictions and treating violators by following the 'Golden Rule' I have found legal actions can be drastically reduced.

Roger Borcherding Official HOATalk.com Sponsor DARCO Property Management (Colorado) (303) 925-0150 *See legal notice below (end of page) or go to www.hoatalk.com/legal

LeeS1

Posts:0

07/23/2006 10:03 AM
To answer Roger's questions: Every issue of our monthly newsletter addresses ACC matters, including publicizing the status of all applications. We have articles, as well, that address the responsibilities of HOs. The website has a lot of information. At the time of closing, the title company also gives them a set of covenants. It's that old saying: You can lead the horse to water, but you can't make him drink. Despite all the proactive measures to prevent lawsuits, you always have that element that decides the covenants are not for them (then my response to them is -- live somewhere else!). Until we get something into our bylaws addressing the issue of legal action, I believe we are dead in the water. The best we can do in the mean time is to keep thorough documentation so that we don't ever lose a case. One good thing--we publicize when the case is adjudicated, and I believe that has cut down on the number of HOs who think the rules don't apply to them.

LindaC3
(Florida)

Posts:526

09/26/2006 1:48 PM
Susie---- As a member of a gated community located in florida could you possibly send me the Statute for the Grievance Commitee? Please send directly to my email address designdiva@hughes.net Thanking you for your help Linda P

HaroldS
(Arizona)

Posts:904

09/26/2006 2:49 PM
CharlesW wrote: I find it very difficult to understand much of the CC&Rs. I have read it all just fine. I couldn’t tell what it meant though. >> Charles - as I understand from other posts, you are now a member of your BOD. You seem so concerned about imposing the rules on your members, but admit you don't even understand your documents yourself - but obviously you expect your homeowners to know and abide by them. I wonder how typical that is of other board members? Harold

CharlesW1
(Georgia)

Posts:820

09/26/2006 4:23 PM
HaroldS, I admit months ago, I was very unsure of much of what I was reading, but I feel I have a much better understanding of the by-laws and CC&R in my sub-division with the advice I received for this discussion forum. There probably are many board members that aren’t familiar with the Rules and Regulation of their community, I don’t blame them one bit. It was my ambition to educate myself on many of these situations (I’ve read about on this forum). I believe that is why it is so difficult for many homeowners to be more involved. Many homeowners are uncertain, unqualified and terrified to do anything to jeopardize their largest financial investment. Considering when you are a board member in my community, you are entirely "volunteering". You "volunteer" your time, (time is money), and your sanity. It’s a very demanding job with a lot of responsibilities. A thankless job! You don’t have to be a board member to be involved. You don’t have to read the by-laws and CC&Rs to know that not mowing your lawn (it’s eight inches tall and the majority of it is weeds) or edging along the side walk out front of your house (where the runners nearly stretch from one side to the other) to know you are not abiding by one of the by-laws or CC&R in your HOA community. I never received any violation notices because I have a sense of pride for my house and my community. I choose to build my home here! In an HOA community! You don’t have to know about the rules of an HOA to know as a homeowner, you should or shouldn't be doing that. Should you!? This is why I wanted to be a board member. I want my community to have a better understanding of all the hard work involved in a yearly meeting, social gathering, or a simple monthly news letter. Mowing your lawn, edging, planting flowers, not leaving your garbage can outside over night, paying your assessments and many of the other typical violations is not being involved, IMO! These are homeowner responsibilities! I have learned a great deal from all of you. I will continue to ask question and ask for advice from the people that are so much more well-informed than I am, in the fields I’m deficient in. Thank you all once again. Chuck W.

Charles E. Wafer Jr.

JerryS1

Posts:8

09/26/2006 8:14 PM
Charles Where can someone get info of state and federal regs in regards to HOA. I have the smae problem with HO not paying fines and my board says there is nothing we can do about it. I say if that is the case then why fine osmeone? 2nd Is there a certain time frame or level of fines that need to be reached in order for us to put a lien on someone's property? Chuy

JerryS1

Posts:8

09/26/2006 8:18 PM
LeeS1 Where can someone get info of state and federal regs in regards to HOA. I have the smae problem with HO not paying fines and my board says there is nothing we can do about it. I say if that is the case then why fine osmeone? 2nd Is there a certain time frame or level of fines that need to be reached in order for us to put a lien on someone's property? Chuy

CharlesW1
(Georgia)

Posts:820

09/27/2006 6:42 AM
Chuy, I am leaning the dos and don’ts of an HOA myself. I found this discussion forum to educate myself as to the by-laws, CC&R and rules and regulations. I have been told by the PM (property manager) that it is a long process, and I was told that the information, which I was asking about, is confidential and can only be shared with board members. At the time I was not a board member. This information couldn’t be disclosed to a member of the association. I found out that the violation procedures listed in the by-laws are being followed, as good as they can, it just takes time. Unfortunately much too long IMO! This is what my by-laws state. 3.21 Fining or Suspension Procedure. The Board shall not impose a fine (a late charge shall not constitute a fine) or suspend a members vote or to use any part of the Common Property unless and until the following procedure is followed. (a) Written notice shall be delivered to the member by first-class or certified mail sent to the address of the member shown on the Association’s records, specifying: (1) The nature of the violation, the fine or suspension to be imposed and the date, not less than fifteen (15) days from the date of the notice, that the fine or suspension will take effect. (2) That the violator may, within ten(10) days from the date of the notice, request a hearing regarding the fine or suspension; (3) the name, address and telephone number of a person to contact to challenge the fine or suspension; (4) that any statement, evidence, and witnesses may be produced by the violator at the hearing; and (5) That all rights to have the fine or suspension reconsidered are waived if a hearing in not requested within ten (10) days of the date of the hearing (6) (b) If a hearing is requested, it shall be held before the Board in executive session, and the violator shall be given a reasonable opportunity to be heard. The minutes of the meeting shall contain a written statement of the results of the hearing. No fine or suspension shall be imposed prior to the date that is five (5) days after the date of the hearing. I am learning much of this my self, I apologize to you for not being more helpful. You must follow what it states in the by-laws and CC&R’s concerning liens and foreclosure proceedings. Best of luck, this forum is full of some very knowledgeable people with some very good advice. If you have time, read as many of the previously posted responses and discussions, this topic has been discussed in great detail. Chuck W.

Charles E. Wafer Jr.

You are not authorized to post a reply.

Forums > Homeowner Association > HOA Discussions > What is next?